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WHO: Millenium-Millie-Gryphon AKA Millie AKA Onyx AKA Onyx Art Studios

WHERE: http://www.furaffinity.net/user/millenium-millie-gryphon

WHAT: 2 x circus poster style images of my otter shape

WHEN: Claimed slots, provided references and paid on February 14th. Inquired on progress April 10th, got response and first pic on April 16th, which was of a wrong character. After informing the artist of that, she did the second pic, then said she will redraw this one, then delayed past the paypal dispute deadline after which stopped responding to notes (still reading them and taking other commissions).

EXPLAIN: Millie opens these commissions via journals/picture announcements on a regular basis. I took two slots and sent info February 14th, 2017, paid same day.

After no progress for a couple months, I’ve contacted Millie on April 10th to check on the progress, and got a response with one image April 16th. There was one problem with that though, it was a wrong character, which I told her. We have reconfirmed the correct references, and May 7th, I got the second picture. That one was pretty well done. I again informed Millie that the first one was wrong, and also mentioned that it was supposed to go with another picture with the same subject from another artist. I have also requested the picture with the wrong character taken down. She said she will redraw it, then it took a series of delays until paypal dispute deadline has expired (in hindsight, I should have opened it, but her staying in communication and being polite kind of led me astray). After that, she stopped responding to notes while reading them, being active and offering further commissions.

PROOF: https://imgur.com/a/eJB32

Artist's beware has moved!
Do NOT repost your old bewares. They are being archived.
https://artistsbeware.info/

Comments

Fralea Comms
Oct. 10th, 2017 07:33 pm (UTC)
Re: I'm the Artist in Question
Its great that you sent OP the fixed piece, and I hope they like how it turned out. I totally understand being overwhelmed by the journals and your policy on WIP. However I still have a couple questions, please.

Did you respond to OP's most recent notes here? - https://i.imgur.com/fvpfcHK.png
If you finished the fix a month ago but forgot to send it, why wasn't it sent in response to the Sept 30 note?

Also, you say "The commissioner did not initially indicate that they were upset with the completed piece," but the screenshot you gave for proof says right from the start that you drew the bear instead of the otter (wrong character). Can you show a screenshot of where the commissioner accepted the commission?

Could you show where you were given the link to the bear journal? In this screenshot - https://i.imgur.com/JW9jgqA.png - there is only one journal listed, which leads to the otter, with nothing mentioning the bear. Someone else mentioned you might have lost the refs and looked on the commissioner's page for them and picked the wrong one on accident, but you say here that you were "given" the bear journal as well as the otter.

Thanks so much if you can clear this stuff up! The whole situation is a little confusing.

Lastly, I want to assure you that no one thinks you are a bad person just from this beware. You as a person and you as a business are different things, and so far you (as a business) have handled it well.
(Screened comment)
celestinaketzia
Oct. 11th, 2017 01:03 am (UTC)
mod comment
Howdy!

Please watch the number of edits that you do on a comment. It emails the moderators for every edit you do, which as you can imagine becomes excessively spammy.
theartofonyx
Oct. 11th, 2017 01:04 am (UTC)
Re: mod comment
Oh god. I'm sorry!
celestinaketzia
Oct. 11th, 2017 01:05 am (UTC)
Re: I'm the Artist in Question
Now typing as a member and not a moderator.

I'm confused as to why you agreed to changes when so much time elapsed. Most people would have said no. If a client came to me three months later, I would have apologized but declined.
whoop_zi
Oct. 11th, 2017 01:21 am (UTC)
mod comment
Howdy! This is being screened as it contains some third party names in the second to last cap of your inbox. You're welcome to repost your comment, but be sure to censor any usernames that aren't you or OP.

You and the mods will still be able to see the original comment, so please do not delete it.
theartofonyx
Oct. 11th, 2017 01:26 am (UTC)
Re: I'm the Artist in Question
Yes, she stated here that "she liked the first one".
https://sta.sh/0meo6pizrke

After that response, the conversation drifted off into other topics and ended.
https://sta.sh/02csfhkpja3q <--- final response
https://sta.sh/02184h3w5xo9 <--- dates
(the last note about this piece was initially sent on the 7th)

I assumed that the issue was resolved and that they liked the pieces despite the mixup.
The piece that I would make to help further apologize for the mixup was something that I would complete in the time that I did not have other commissioners waiting on their pieces.

It was not until OVER THREE MONTHS later (August 19th) that they wanted new art, even though they had said that they 'liked the first one'.
https://sta.sh/01p6u8hfl34t

((To the mod: I fixed the third party thing on this one! I'm so sorry. I'm trying not to botch this up too terribly))
M-ree BiPolar
Oct. 11th, 2017 06:29 am (UTC)
Re: I'm the Artist in Question
Just two points to clarify here.

"Liked" there is a case of translation error. The art quality is really awesome. It's not me liking the thing personally -- which we discussed as well.

And I waited for a while for the fixed piece because you said literally "I'll make sure to make you a piece to make up for the first commission" and it took you a few months to get them done in the first place. So the assumption was that it will take a while to complete it, too.

Fralea Comms
Oct. 11th, 2017 06:29 am (UTC)
Re: I'm the Artist in Question
So the one that starts "Thanks hun. As I mentioned...." was sent on August 7? or May 7?

"The piece that I would make to help further apologize for the mixup was something that I would complete in the time that I did not have other commissioners waiting on their pieces. "

Not sure what you are refering to here. Did I miss something? I don't remember any talk of you making a third drawing anywhere.
M-ree BiPolar
Oct. 11th, 2017 07:15 am (UTC)
Re: I'm the Artist in Question
That particular one was May 7th.

I didn't send anything on August 7th, the next times I checked on it was June 23rd (which I at the time did not notice went unread, https://imgur.com/8zcxEm0), then August 19th and September 30th.

The "third" drawing likely refers to "I'll make sure to make you a piece to make up for the first commission".

Fralea Comms
Oct. 11th, 2017 01:41 pm (UTC)
Re: I'm the Artist in Question
Okay. See to me, that "thanks, hun..." message read as asking for the piece to be fixed while trying to be polite not offend the artist. In this case, you were probably too polite as the artist didn't pick up on you being unhappy. If it were me, I would have double checked since I made a clear mistake even if you had explicitly said you were happy, but one of my first experiences where I did a free request I had a similar situation, where the user disliked what I drew but didn't say it outright so I had to guess. I would suggest in the future to try and be explicit when you want changes. There are polite ways to phrase those sorts of things and it really helps artists to have a clear, undisputable idea of what the client wants.

As for the "make up" phrasing, I (and I think you as well) misread that as the artist agreeing to redraw the polar bear image into the otter image. Correct me if I'm wrong.

So from your POV, you told the artist right away and waited for 3 months with nothing to show for it. From the artist's POV, everything was great and then 3 months later you are suddenly unhappy.
M-ree BiPolar
Oct. 11th, 2017 07:25 am (UTC)
Re: I'm the Artist in Question
I am not sure how asking to take a picture down could be misread for liking it. And if you going over the timeline, then it is:

February 14th: Me sending you references and payment and you acknowledging it:
Refs -- me ottah, https://www.furaffinity.net/journal/3935715
Paypal -- MreeBiPolar@gmail.com
Talents -- assistant (submersion?) and firewalker.

(Almost 2 months)

April 10th: Me first asking if there's any progress.

April 16th: You posting that pic, me mentioning it's the wrong character and
M-ree BiPolar
Oct. 11th, 2017 07:48 am (UTC)
Re: I'm the Artist in Question
(So "quote" button does absolutely not what I thought it does)

[...]
April 16th: You posting that pic, me mentioning it's the wrong character and you stating you "thought for sure you wanted your polar bear!"

(almost a month)

May 7th: You sending me the second pic and me requesting to take down the first one.

Ok, maybe it was wrong for me to wait with that, but in my experience, escalating an issue when there are other outstanding images usually poorly affects their quality.

Also, you stating, "And I'll make sure to make you a piece to make up for the first commission." which I read as you going to redraw it.

June 23rd: Me checking whether you have got to it (and unfortunately, not noticing at the time that the message went unread).

Compared to the time it took you to get the first and second pics done, respectively, as well as your journals mentioning the exams, I think that was pretty reasonable time to wait.

August 19th: Me asking again. Message read, no reply.

September 30th: Me asking once more. Once again, read, no reply.

October 7th: Me posting the beware journal.

October 10th: You contacting me and saying you forgot to upload it before. And linking a 5-minutes edit removing the tattoos (their remains can even still be seen pretty well if you know what to look for), then stating here that you did it a month ago (which would be about September 10th, well three weeks before I contacted you the second time. Pardon me if I don't buy that at all.

Oct. 10th, 2017 09:05 pm (local)
Re: I'm the Artist in Question
Thank you for saying so.

As to your question, I actually completed it about a month ago but forgot to upload it [...]
theartofonyx
Oct. 11th, 2017 03:46 pm (UTC)
Re: I'm the Artist in Question
At the end of the day. I have fixed your piece as desired (which you have not replied to yet on FA) and this post is still actively going down.
https://sta.sh/02br3cn8p30a

I don't understand why this post is still up, as the issue at hand has been resolved.

I feel as though I have defended myself decently as a person and artist and have completed my end of helping resolve this.
Anything further just feels like fighting/arguing for the sake of it, which I'm not a fan of or wish to participate in.

I'm honestly sorry that you didn't like the art and that this commissioning process went as rockily as it did.
M-ree BiPolar
Oct. 11th, 2017 04:00 pm (UTC)
Re: I'm the Artist in Question
I don't want this dragged any further, either, just did not expect to find a few dozens new comments here after the FA exchange. I can't reply on FA now (or for next few hours) though.

For what it's worth, I am sorry for all the mess and the miscommunication here. I've learned my lesson to be more direct and keep business and casual conversations separate.

And yes, you are a REALLY good artist -- art-wise. I would suggest using something like trello or doodle to keep a bit more organized though.
MOD COMMENT - celestinaketzia - Oct. 11th, 2017 04:27 pm (UTC) - Expand

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