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WHO: Fenrir's Child/Mordrude's Monsters

WHERE: http://www.furaffinity.net/user/fenrirschild/ http://www.furaffinity.net/user/mordrudesmonsters http://fenrirschild.deviantart.com/ http://www.mordrudesmonsters.com/

WHAT: Full fursuit commission

WHEN: First payment May 20, 2011, paid in full July 31, 2011. Fursuit head stolen early December 2012, refund received January 23, 2013.

PROOF: Paypal payments: http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y93/SirFratley/Paypalscreen-1.jpg (Fen's real name blurred, all non-relevant transactions crossed out)
Initial Contact: http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y93/SirFratley/InitialContact.png
Fen's old TOS: http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y93/SirFratley/FensTOS.png
FA notes, kindly provided by Synwolf, showing proof of Fen's accusations that I stole the head:
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/811/fenrisnotes1.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/547/fenrisnotes2.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/259/fenrisnotes3.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/829/fenrisnotes4.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/580/fenrisnotes5.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/255/fenrisnotes6.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/812/fenrisnotes7.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/6/fenrisnotes8.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/163/fenrisnotes9.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/90/fenrisnotes10.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/822/fenrisnotes11.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/839/fenrisnotes12.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/705/fenrisnotes13.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/836/fenrisnotes14.jpg/

EXPLAIN: I commissioned Fenrir's Child/Mordrude's Monsters for a full fursuit in 2011, with the original soft completion date of Rainfurrest 2011. We knew it was an ambitious target, so it wasn't disappointing when it wasn't done yet. Shortly after Rainfurrest 2011, there was some personal drama between myself and my ex best friend, which Fenrir's Child had inadvertently became involved with in other ways. Unknown to me at the time, this caused her to lose motivation to work on my fursuit. Several deadlines were set and missed. The first deadline after the drama was for January 2012, where I would pick up the fursuit for the When Furballs Strike 8 bowling meet in Kenmore, WA. When my wife and I went, the fursuit was not yet completed. The head was finished on the outside, but unwearable due to incomplete interior work.

Because of the delays, Fen had offered free upgrades to make up for the extended wait. I gladly accepted. Unfortunately, upgrades aren't any good unless you actually get the fursuit.

The next date was set for another When Furballs Strike meet in late May 2012. Again, the fursuit was not complete, with several months going by with absolutely no work done. The next completion date was set for Halloween 2012. Needless to say, it wasn't finished either. In November Fen had opened up for more commissions, and one of my closest friends had posted on her journal asking about my fursuit: http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y93/SirFratley/Journalcomment.png Shortly after, Fen had finally come forward with why she had not been working on my fursuit this whole time, and offered a partial refund, which I politely declined because of financial troubles on her end: http://pastebin.com/k2PACa6X We decided to push for December completion.

In early December, it was discovered that my head was missing, believed stolen. We discussed various options, including her remaking a head if I don't dock her in reviews or I pay $300, I get the remainder of the suit plus a partial refund, or, least desireable, a full refund. However, she backed out of any agreements and said she will be refunding me, without any say in the matter, in 45 days from the date of the police report for the claimed theft. Here is the full chatlog from that conversation: http://pastebin.com/q1UbWVix

On the day the refund was due, she paid at 10 PM, without answering my emails or IMs asking what's going on, since it was getting late in the day and I still hadn't received my refund. Thankfully I did eventually find the refund in my paypal account, and our transaction is closed.

Throughout this entire ordeal, I have been as patient as humanly possible, when all my friends were saying I should be making a fuss and have posted her on A_B a long time ago. Before the head was stolen, even Fen agrees I've been extremely patient: http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y93/SirFratley/FensaysImpatient.png This entire commission has been nothing but constant waiting and repeated disappointment. There were many times I had felt absolutely trapped. I wanted to speak up and say she was taking too long, but if I did, I feared she would rush and push out a sub-par product, or give up and refund me without even trying to finish it. When she backed out of our agreement to let me have the rest of the fursuit minus the head, the gloves came off.

While Fen's quality of work is extremely good, she simply lacks professionalism, basic business ethics, and the ability to complete large projects on time, allowing personal drama to interfere with her commissions. For small items such as tails, she would be a great builder to consider, but for anything more, I say Buyer Beware.

Edit: Updated the proof to include initial email and Fen's old TOS. Also fixed a typo that had been driving me nuts.
Edit 2: Added the FA notes between Synwolf and Fen, kindly provided by Synwolf.
Artist's beware has moved!
Do NOT repost your old bewares. They are being archived.
https://artistsbeware.info/

Comments

( 236 comments — Leave a comment )
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drone_dragon
Jan. 29th, 2013 04:35 am (UTC)
Wow. I wasn't expecting to see Fen's name pop up here on AB. Then again- I was aware that sometimes her commissions take longer than the average length of time to wait for a fursuit completion, but indeed the results seemed worth the wait.

A very thorough post.

Shortly after Rainfurrest 2011, there was some personal drama between myself and my ex best friend, which Fenrir's Child had inadvertently became involved with in other ways. Unknown to me at the time, this caused her to lose motivation to work on my fursuit.

I'm not sure if you needed to add this tidbit of exposition, since 'drama' can be considered such a two sided monster. I believe the evidence toward the amount of waiting you had to do was strong enough. Out of curiosity; do you have any screen shots of your original commissioning details that you traded between you and Fen back in 2011?
oceandezignz
Jan. 29th, 2013 04:41 am (UTC)
While I agree its not a pretty tidbit, Fenrir has admitted that the interplay of personal drama with business responsibilities lead to the prolonged completion of the suit.

Two-sided monster yes (again I do agree its not the BEST piece of proof in the world) but its still evidence that they willingly stalled instead of refunding and calling it quits when they seemed uncomfortable.
(no subject) - drone_dragon - Jan. 29th, 2013 04:51 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - lazer_the_hyena - Jan. 29th, 2013 04:41 am (UTC) - Expand
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lazer_the_hyena
Jan. 29th, 2013 04:43 am (UTC)
I am wondering if Fen didn't figure they could make another head to go with the body and then resell the full suit for a higher price than what you paid (Since they kept stating that they severely under charged), thus making it more profitable to refund you and sell for a higher price somewhere else. Otherwise I do not see how in the world keeping the rest of the suit made any sense at all.

Did you ever see the body suit/tail/paws at all? You are completely sure they exist?
xisidereal
Jan. 29th, 2013 04:44 am (UTC)
They're posted on Fen's FA page since someone accused her of destroying them.

-> http://www.furaffinity.net/view/9432815/ found the link.

Edited at 2013-01-29 04:45 am (UTC)
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timelapsedecay
Jan. 29th, 2013 04:46 am (UTC)
Oh. This stuff again.
I don't agree with the way she did things after the theft actually occurred. That's what I'll say about it
mazz
Jan. 29th, 2013 04:56 am (UTC)
This is the first time I heard the side of this story from the commissioner...
Out of all of it, I am disappointed they allowed personal drama of getting together with your ex to affect their business...

Edited at 2013-01-29 04:57 am (UTC)
(Screened comment)
(no subject) - xisidereal - Jan. 29th, 2013 05:06 am (UTC) - Expand
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(no subject) - takesu - Jan. 29th, 2013 05:09 am (UTC) - Expand
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ljmydayaway
Jan. 29th, 2013 05:09 am (UTC)
I said this last time this came up, and I'll say it again. There was no "agreement" between you and her. She was discussing it as "options" with your partner - not you - who did not decide on an option. (I think it's neat you left that part out this time.)

Once you were available to talk, the artist had decided on different options that worked out better.

"On the day the refund was due, she paid at 10 PM, without answering my emails or IMs asking what's going on, since it was getting late in the day and I still hadn't received my refund. Thankfully I did eventually find the refund in my paypal account, and our transaction is closed."

Oh good. I missed this on my first read-through, but it sounds like she came through in the end.

There's no reason to make a jab at what time she paid or that she didn't reply to your IMs. She's not under any obligation to speak with you.
neolucky
Jan. 29th, 2013 05:11 am (UTC)
Tone down the hostility a little, please. You can state facts on the whole ordeal without it being agressive. We wanna keep things nice and mellow.
(no subject) - ljmydayaway - Jan. 29th, 2013 03:03 pm (UTC) - Expand
sharpecostumes
Jan. 29th, 2013 05:52 am (UTC)
I'm going to state something I don't think has been stated. While it was YOUR character, it was HER work being advertised. Such fur she was using, if discontinued, would be very difficult to find, thus making the new head an oddball upon the body. You might not have minded, but Fen being a perfectionist within her craft (not a bad thing mind you) she wanted her work to be best represented in any way she could. With an oddball head it would have looked really off to her and would have been uncomfortable to her to send on. To be honest if I was in her shoes as a maker I would not either. There have been several times I have worked with a piece and scrapped it, starting over entirely if I didn't feel it was up to my standards.

With all of the drama that has been around this, it would not be productive to sell the rest without putting precious time into altering it of which it would be more beneficial to just scrapping it entirely and reusing the materials.

Honestly this entire ordeal has been hugely blown out of proportion mostly by word of mouth and the head should have been posted as stolen, no more details given. As it seems, as more of the story, background, and history was given, the more the drama exploded, being fueled by rumors, miscommunication, and just outright bad form. An item was stolen, a commission scrapped, a full refund given. Was there drama in the middle? Yes. Were this handled as they said they were? Yes. Did things get out of hand on both sides? Certainly. But hey, that's business.
jakejynx
Jan. 29th, 2013 06:23 am (UTC)
I agree with this completely. A lot of people seem to be having issues with the fact that Fen decided to just cancel and full refund. But, hey, it's our right as artists to refuse service to anyone for any reason. As long as all of the money is returned, there's not really much of a reason to complain about that, and speculate about why it was done. I would also feel pretty weird about giving someone a bodysuit that couldn't possibly match a head made at a later time by another maker (hence why I try to avoid using 'unique' furs unless I have a ton of it in stock that I'm hoarding for later). So I understand why she would want to just scrap the whole thing.
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brownspotz
Jan. 29th, 2013 06:01 am (UTC)
if I have read correctly, you commissioned a suit with head,during the process the head for the suit got stolen,you asked for a full refund,she cant produce refund but offers body suit minus head or pay another $300 for a suit with a head that was already paid for?
lazer_the_hyena
Jan. 29th, 2013 06:08 am (UTC)
No, the op commissioned a full suit. The head was stolen, the commissioner wanted the remainder of the suit without the head and a refund of $300 for the missing head. The artist decided to refuse to give them the rest of the suit and instead gave a full refund, which was against the commissioner's wishes.
(no subject) - celestinaketzia - Jan. 29th, 2013 07:53 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - lurkerwisp - Jan. 30th, 2013 12:14 am (UTC) - Expand
mekania
Jan. 29th, 2013 06:30 am (UTC)
I'm not in the furry fandom but I was reading the journals/comments related to this and how quickly you were jumped on as suspect for wanting the rest of the suit. Is it not common that sometimes people buy partials and commission the rest at another time/from someone else?

Fenrir's "this is my decision THE END NO DISCUSSION" is reeeeeally offputting. While a full refund may be something that is completely her right, I think it still reflects badly on her. You may have all that money back but now you're out 19 months (all the "But I did free upgrades!!!" is moot because she's not giving you the suit) and have to find a new fursuiter equal to her skills for a similar price and for how everyone seems to rave about her quality I don't understand why people can't grasp why you'd be upset at not getting the body suit.

The whole situation is really weird and while I'm not even going to guess at what happened to the head all the reasons for not giving you the suit reflect pretty poorly on the artist.
1. thinks you stole the head to get a refund even though she already offered you a refund and the whole suit and you declined.
2. is mad you were not sympathetic enough to her home being violated (while understandable, you didn't do anything wrong there)/She doesn't think a product being stolen is her problem at all which is not a good attitude. I'm glad she at least gave a refund but she gives off the impression that since she undercharged you, you're lucky to get even that regardless of your feelings.
3. doesn't want her suit to be matched with someone else's head which I think is none of her business. She didn't/couldn't replace the head herself that's no reason to leave the commissioner in the dust.
marus_puppy
Jan. 29th, 2013 06:48 am (UTC)
I don't know if I'd call it common, but it's generally acceptable to be done. I think the only thing that's weird in this case is that people will usually get a head, gloves/feet, and a tail and either never get a body (wearing street clothes in place of that) or get the body later. There's not really a use for a body without a head...
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shukivengeance
Jan. 29th, 2013 06:35 am (UTC)
All arguments on whether it should've been only Fen's call to make the refund aside, the initial wait in the first place along with how she conducted herself during the drama storm after the head got stolen is what makes this beware valid to me.

It is not okay to:
-drag out a transaction and make a customer wait even longer due to third party drama that they had no part in,
-miss multiple deadlines,
-publicly accuse a customer of theft,
-have a pity party and penalize the customer because of how long YOU took to make their product (seriously all the "I undercharged by my current prices bawww" crap was sickening).
mekania
Jan. 29th, 2013 06:40 am (UTC)
ha, I was just adding that same things! This is exactly what I was thinking.
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mekania
Jan. 29th, 2013 06:39 am (UTC)
Alsooo: [17:24] mordrude: I am offering a full refund, since I cannot complete the transaction as agreed upon, that says enough about my professionalism

You know what says a lot about professionalism? Letting personal drama interfere with a business transaction. Missing deadlines. Complaining to your customer about how much you'd be out for redoing a head that was misplaced on your watch (at your new prices even though it's your fault it was delayed so long). Bribing customers into not publicly expressing how poorly you've acted during a transaction.
neolucky
Jan. 29th, 2013 06:56 am (UTC)
That really really got under my skin, the whole bribing bit. Sheesh.
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tyrano_tiggs
Jan. 29th, 2013 07:20 am (UTC)
http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/4265193/

There's something about naming and calling you out in this journal that makes me uncomfortable.
Probably the fact her fan base decided YOU stole the head and now have a name to link to the accusations :/

For all her harps about professionalism, she doesn't practice what she preaches.
neolucky
Jan. 29th, 2013 07:27 am (UTC)
I am baffled as to why she felt the need to post that, when she wants this all behind her. Way to keep dredging up the drama, there, Fen. This was just totally pointless and tactless.
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mordrude
Jan. 29th, 2013 07:39 am (UTC)
I am going to comment once, and only once on this post. I believe I said all that needed said on the FA postings over the past few weeks/months, so if anyone needs more info they are more than free to look there. I have nothing to hide, and have been as transparent as feasible throughout this whole ordeal.

Cani was my fourth commission for anything over a tail. My second customer cancelled due to personal reasons, and I wound up refunding my third in full due to discovering some serious issues with the duct tape dummy he provided after I had already made the bodysuit and did not wish to redo the suit. Cani took the second person's slot, so he was aware I was inexperienced with large orders. To offset the risk of me taking longer than expected, my prices were almost absurdly low. I made it clear that I do not do hard deadlines, and as such I have never agreed to a deadline of any sort on this commission. Any completion dates were estimates, and nothing more.

That said, I take the brunt of the blame for taking so long. I personally feel it was unacceptable, whether there are other makers who also take just as long on a suit or not. I also made the rookie mistake of befriending a customer, which greatly contributed to the resulting situation. Shortly after Rainfurrest 2011, some things happened between the customer and I that made me uncomfortable about working on his project. I will not get into further detail on what happened because I don't feel it is relevant and would only cause more unnecessary drama. I should have refunded him at this point, but I was so close to done I couldn't bring myself to do so.

In November we both aired our grievances with each other and found a renewed drive to finish his project. I worked diligently on his suit, and provided him with numerous updates. I had offered a second set of handpaws and feet paws in a newer style as well as making a new tail with fur that I had acquired after I had already made one for him made because I felt it matched his character better. I was doing what I could to try to make up for the inexcusable wait by replacing items I had already made at my expense with ones that I felt he would be happier with. I was at the point where I was ready to do the upgrades to his head to more closely match how his character had evolved over the wait when I discovered the head had been stolen. After a thorough search, I contacted the authorities and started the process of an investigation. I contacted him immediately as I felt it was important to keep him in the loop when it was his project that had gotten stolen. As I had been worked up about the situation and wanted to make sure he was involved, I quickly gave him some potential options without fully thinking them through. This may have been a mistake on my part however nothing was finalized at thie time of this discussion and I was merely throwing out some ideas to rectify the situation.

Once I posted the flier to FA about the stolen head to try and get word out in hopes that it could be recovered and delivered to the customer, it quickly turned into a lot of unnecessary drama. I got numerous messages from numerous people on FA informing me that Cani's initial response was to post an attack journal against me to stir drama. No sharing of the stolen notice, no helping to get the word out, an attack on me personally. To my knowledge, he has not made an attempt at all in helping to recover the head, but laughed about it with a troll claiming to have bought the head - https://twitter.com/evil_sibe/status/278188113191387138

(One of two, split due to character limit)
mordrude
Jan. 29th, 2013 07:39 am (UTC)
After discussing with the detective on my case and confirming that this would be an acceptable course of action in a professional setting, I told Cani he would receive a full refund 45 days from the start of the investigation, which was paid on the date promised. I am far from a scammer. I know some people do not agree with my decision to refund, but considering the circumstances I was not willing to remake the head, and I never do bodysuits only as I do not feel it showcases my work to a level that I feel is acceptable. I made this very clear from my first response to him: http://i.imgur.com/7ftiwZ4.jpg.

Tl;dr: I take the brunt of the culpability for the wait time, although I made it clear from the onset of the commission that I do not take hard deadlines. I personally do not find his wait acceptable, and was giving him about $900 worth of free upgrades to make his suit of the same quality I would put out had he commissioned me today. I made rookie mistakes, because I was a rookie. This theft was far from a normal situation, obviously, and I feel I handled it as well as I was capable. He has been fully refunded, as promised, because it was, and never has been, my intent to rip anyone off. I have learned a lot from this situation, and intend to have it help me grow as an artist, and as a person.

(Two of two, split due to character limit)
(no subject) - shukivengeance - Jan. 29th, 2013 07:55 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - mekania - Jan. 29th, 2013 08:09 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - tyrano_tiggs - Jan. 29th, 2013 08:15 am (UTC) - Expand
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(Deleted comment)
ritsukaao
Jan. 29th, 2013 11:12 am (UTC)
I recall this popping up on the other communities. I thought the whole thing was...unsettling. I didn't think Fen destroyed the head or purposely "misplaced" it but I don't know if I believe the story of it being stolen either. (I could be wrong.) I guess the big question is whether or not Fen will try to sell the bodysuit for more than Cani paid in a few months/weeks/days. (Which is pretty underhanded and speaks volumes of the fact that she was annoyed that Cani got a cheaper suit despite her improved skills.) If the suit was sold at a similar price, I'd have less issue with it though.

That would put the nail in the coffin for me.

Edited at 2013-01-29 11:12 am (UTC)
norsepaw
Jan. 29th, 2013 11:47 am (UTC)
I dont think she will sell the rest of the suit since the grey fur used are no longer being sold or even found, its very very rare now.
(no subject) - ritsukaao - Jan. 29th, 2013 09:07 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - celestinaketzia - Jan. 29th, 2013 09:14 pm (UTC) - Expand
familliaraver
Jan. 29th, 2013 04:21 pm (UTC)
I just wanted to compliment you on your professional post. You kept to the facts and didn't mention drama. When I scrolled down and saw this post finally ended up here I was ready to read something awful and I was left pleasantly surprised.

Yes, it didn't seem like she was ready to take commissions with a hard deadline. She still needed more time to perfect her methods. Yes, it was a complete mess. I know you wanted your suit and you would have waited forever or you would have at least gotten the head and it sucks to get nothing at all.

Fen was also tried to keep herself as professional as possible and I think she gets points for that. She was calm through the whole thing and honest about the what and why.

I do think she will take some time off to put things in order, learn from her mistakes without making excuses and grow as a person and an artist.
familliaraver
Jan. 29th, 2013 04:22 pm (UTC)
*Also tried*
(no subject) - lazer_the_hyena - Jan. 29th, 2013 05:34 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - familliaraver - Jan. 29th, 2013 06:22 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - lazer_the_hyena - Jan. 29th, 2013 08:29 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - familliaraver - Jan. 29th, 2013 09:15 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - lazer_the_hyena - Jan. 29th, 2013 09:20 pm (UTC) - Expand
canilupine
Jan. 29th, 2013 05:53 pm (UTC)
I was planning on letting my Beware do all the talking, but some posters brought up important points I'd like to clarify for everyone.

As shown in the chatlogs, I was nothing but patient and courteous with Fen, up until she made the decision to refund me without giving me any say in the matter, after I had agreed to two of the options she had presented me. Only after that is when I spoke out publicly against Fen and posted to my DeviantArt journals. When she posted the stolen head alert on her FA, several people took my silence as an admission of guilt, but I didn't want to speak publicly until Fen and I had discussed the business end of things.

Also, claims that I have done nothing to aid the search are false. I posted an alert on several furry Facebook groups I am a member of. Screencap: http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y93/SirFratley/FacebookPSA.png

With the police investigation, Fen had only told the detective about the fursuit head and neglected to mention the rest. In my conversation with the detective, he mentioned he found out that the commission was more more than just the head through my DA journals. There were also no signs of forced entry to Fen's garage, but there wasn't enough evidence to secure a search warrant to search Fen's home for the head.

Furthermore, the deputy confirmed that Fen indeed accused me of stealing the head, but even he agreed that it makes no sense and didn't consider me a suspect.

In response to Drone Dragon, yes, I do have the first emails from our initial contact, but it's too large to screencap. I might need to find a program that'll take scrolling screenshots.
(Deleted comment)
(no subject) - canilupine - Jan. 29th, 2013 06:26 pm (UTC) - Expand
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(no subject) - canilupine - Jan. 29th, 2013 06:43 pm (UTC) - Expand
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(no subject) - oceandezignz - Feb. 2nd, 2013 08:20 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - kayfox - Feb. 4th, 2013 12:36 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - canilupine - Feb. 3rd, 2013 02:36 am (UTC) - Expand
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