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Update

you all know that Starfinder and I had a little trouble with a long long overdue art trade..

well, just to keep you all informed, she just last night finished it and showed it to me - and it appears that she is really cracking down and doing a lot of overdue trades and mishes as well.

just so you know. :)
Artist's beware has moved!
Do NOT repost your old bewares. They are being archived.
https://artistsbeware.info/

Comments

( 20 comments — Leave a comment )
acrimonius
Jul. 24th, 2005 12:56 am (UTC)
Yeah, and all thanks to the petition midnight_foxx put up. Or, perhaps, only because of it. :p

Word of warning to the commissioners and people that she's owed things to -- keep an eye on the quality. Judging from the bitchy "HMPH WELL I'M SICK OF THE DRAMA" post she made, her habits haven't entirely changed, which probably means at least one or two of you are going to be on the receiving end of one of her shitty, rushed pieces. Don't tolerate it.
sepp
Jul. 24th, 2005 03:03 am (UTC)
you're right - she did a really rushed job on mine... though I'm just glad she did it - and it did turn out satisfactory in my eyes, so I'm not pushing it - though, all of you that she still owes art to - dont' lay down just because she finished it. make sure you get quality, not quantity for such a long time to wait and brood.
acrimonius
Jul. 24th, 2005 06:52 am (UTC)
*buries face in hands* Oh, LJ Random Images Generator, how I love thee ...

http://starfinder.biz/sf-watergazer2.jpg hot off the presses, posted within the last half-hour.

She's back to heavily referencing poses already. Damn if I can remember the original artist(s), though. Lucky for her, the pose is so common she could've gotten it from anywhere. Artists_beware still applies.
wuffit
Jul. 24th, 2005 03:12 pm (UTC)
crssafox
Jul. 25th, 2005 03:54 pm (UTC)
If you read her journal, you'll notice that she says that the same exact person wanted pretty much the same exact thing, minus background.
watergazer
Aug. 22nd, 2005 07:25 am (UTC)
About this subject
It's been a while since these comments were made, and the issue largely cleared up...but since I am here and just found this, I will give my 2 cents.

I am watergazer, the one who bought the commission(s).
I drew the initial pose idea, this is what I wanted and she practically did it line for line according to my instruction.
After she finished the image the first time with the background, I decided that I had liked the initial artist progress shots (those that only the commissioner sees) so much that I asked her to continue from a certain point with the same image using the universal light theme, and do the image over so this could become a logo design for me.
Yes, I asked her for two of practically the same image and paid for two images.

As for what people are saying about quality. Just look at the quality I got here for both of these. Now, on the second image there needs to be one or two things added to or tweaked, but you have to keep in mind that she does have a lot of commissions and little things can easily be passed over and/or forgotten. It is not intentional. It is also up to the commissioner to point these things out and not be afraid to say so. She's not going to bite you. She's a great person to talk to in person and has the business know-how to accept that the commissoner should get exactly what they want and pay for.
It does take her a while to do a commission, but I was ware of that from the get-go because she told me herself. Quality comes at the expense of time. Someone should be willing to wait for good quality.
watergazer
Aug. 22nd, 2005 07:26 am (UTC)
About this subject cont.

I don't know why people have issues with Starfinder, and I hate how with any image she produces people seem to want to attack her for some kind of art theft or slacking off on her work when it's so obvious that certain poses are super common and that she does excellent quality for the price she charges.
She's been called a hack...a hack of what? Her skill level is balancing on the wire between Carl Brenders and Terry Isaac and people call her a hack? Come on people...she's young, still dealing with school pressures and family issues, money and other typical things, and yet she produces such beauty as I have personally never before seen in someone her age. Along with all the stuff she has to do for school she turns out amazing work. Going to school and then coming home to spend hours drawing - it takes real dedication. People need to realize that she does have school to worry about, tests, homework, projects, etc. and then also commissions...and don't tell me she isn't allowed a personal life on the side as well.
Now, I'm an artist, and I see this from the perspetive of an artist...but I am also a buyer and commissioner of art from all levels of talent. I expect nothing less than what I pay for and a demand quality. I expect nothing less, but I am also understanding because I know what it takes. I also know the anger felt when someone accuses me of taking a pose from someplace or using someone elses idea when in actuality I came up with it on my own...it's aggravating to be accused of such things. Poses and ideas can't be copyrighted. everything has pretty much been done under the sun when it comes to crouching poses anyway. Everyone just automatically thinks things are a rip from Goldenwolf just because she happens to be a bigger name and did something like that before. If Starfinder was a complete hack and thief like some say, then wouldn't she just be doing wolves too like Goldenwolf? No, she does all kinds of species. And while we're on the subject of stolen ideas...what about some of Goldenwolf's ideas for werewolf accessories that look directly taken from the Confrontation Wolfen miniatures series? Nobody has put two and two together on THAT front have they? Or if so, they dare not say it. Nobody points this out because Goldenwolf is Goldenwolf...but since Starfinder is trying to make a name for herself she's constantly having to fight back against people telling her she's just a hack or a rip-off artist. Give me a break.
And this is not to say that Goldenwolf is a hack for "ripping off" Confrontation. Good ideas get around. It just does. Confrontation put out werewolf miniatures that LOTS of people admire and referance from. IT's NOT stealing at all. So why should Starfinder constantly get accused of the more trivial things? This is why it is so hard and frustrating for up and coming artists to get into the field...because so many people strike them down. I'm personally amazed that she isn't giving up her struggle. Other artists would just quit under the constant barrage of comments such as these and might even just stop doing art for business forever or leave the genre. I sure couldn't put up with it. The rush to get an image out before other artists come up with the idea or pose or clothing or eyes or fur has become so staggeringly intense that some of us, myself included, have just stopped bothering!
So after Starfinder make a new post of art, maybe some of you ought to think about what really went into that piece before jumping to conclusions; maybe you ought to start supporting the "lesser" artists instead of helping shove them down further into a pack of rumors; and maybe you ought to look at those "idols" of art and see who THEIR idols are...and see if you also find such "hackness" and so-called rushed commissions...because by your definitaions they will be there.
acrimonius
Aug. 22nd, 2005 06:40 pm (UTC)
Re: About this subject cont.
Just because she didn't take you for a fool doesn't make her a responsible artist. Dozens of people have been effectively the victims of Starfinder's "take the money and run" habit, and dozens more know all about Starfinder's (potentially formerly) ongoing dramatics. Of note, she's sworn she'd change her ways before probably about six times, and decided to go back to telling her table-mates to ward off the people that have already paid her for things so she could go dick around on the beach. At a convention. In a state she lives in. When she promised she'd have the work done.

It's great and all that you're championing her cause and turning her into some sort of martyr crucified by the uncaring masses, but you might want to open your eyes a little wider and clear the wax out of your ears. Maybe reading exactly how many individual people with legitimate complaints signed that petition to ban Starfinder from selling at FurCon would help. It might also help for you to know that out of the fifty-some-odd signatures (at last check, last month), the number of folk who were there from the beginning of Starfinder's illustrious career as an untrustworthy artist, and therefore the most likely to hold a grudge, number in the single digits.

In other words, the vast majority of the people who signed that petition were either burned or had friends that were burned by her, either by waiting for years for work they paid for while she worked on commissions that cost more money and had longer time limits than theirs, noodled around and did piles of personal artwork, outright refused to give refunds, or simply ignored them until they gave up their money and commission for lost.

That is why people are so cynical. Not because Starry is easy to hate on, but because her reputation is very well-earned, and has spanned her entire career of offering commissions to the fandom -- regardless of whether or not you choose to see it. However, you're exactly like every other knight in shining armor she's ever attracted, so I doubt you'll learn unless you get burned yourself.

There is a chance that she has honestly changed. However, there are many people who aren't going to ignore a track record that's full of wasted second, third, fourth, and fifth chances.

And, off-topic, but why do people always feel the need to chew me out eight years after the fact, and especially if I've apologized, not made any further commentary on the topic anywhere, and the subject has been dropped? Do I have "hey, I'm easily annoyed, come bother me" written across my forehead or something?

I CRY EMO TEARS AND SLASH WRISTS NOW. ::::::::::::::::(((((((((((((((((((((((((((
acrimonius
Aug. 22nd, 2005 06:42 pm (UTC)
Re: About this subject cont.
To whit, she has bitten the hands that have fed her. Repeatedly.

As for Goldenwolf, that's a rant that'll very quickly get me into trouble, but yes, I agree with you on all points and dislike her artwork almost as much as I dislike Starry's. Starry is a bad copy of a bad original. :P
acrimonius
Jul. 24th, 2005 06:53 am (UTC)
Oh oh, found it.

http://www.goldenwolfen.com/archive/2000andOlder/index.cgi?page=6&picture=ritual.jpg

She changed enough of it to be considered "safe," but ... blah. Stupid girl.
sepp
Jul. 24th, 2005 07:59 am (UTC)
okay, you know what? it's similar yes, but poses can NOT be copyrighted.

just because people you don't particularly like this artist right now does not mean she's an art thief.
I happen to know that the pose in sf's piece was requested by the commissioner, not to mention that these two paintings are completely different in subject. you're just looking for reasons to blame this girl now... and that really irks me.
just because goldenwolf did it doesn't mean that everyone wants to copy it and be like her.
rediculous.
acrimonius
Jul. 24th, 2005 08:13 am (UTC)
*raises eyebrows* Did you miss the part where I said the pose was insanely common anyway, or did you deliberately ignore it so you had more to get angry at? Pardon my lack of clairvoyancy, too; next time I'll be sure to consult with my resident totem to find out precisely how the poses were ordered.

All sarcasm aside, as it is I am sorry for, uh, crying wolf. I do wanna say that I don't precisely have a grudge; the chick's been scamming people and has been a known hack for almost or over five years, so I'm paranoid when it comes to the things she does. It's absolutely not undeserved. :p
sepp
Jul. 24th, 2005 08:35 am (UTC)
no, I didn't miss the point where you said it was a common pose. if you think that way yourself, you wouldn't go at her with the art theft charge because you obviously would have believed it.

and I don't expect you to be psychic about such things, I was merely stating that fact to suppourt my argument. don't make me sound like an asshole when I'm not being one please.


all sarcasm aside, thank you for your apology, I'm sure it doesn't go unnoticed.
acrimonius
Jul. 24th, 2005 08:47 am (UTC)
Gar. It wasn't an art theft charge. It was pointing out blatant referencing. ._.; My bad (again). This is what I get for posting at stupid o'clock in the morning while annoyed. :p
basilbadger
Jul. 24th, 2005 09:47 am (UTC)
ZOMG Art theft!!!

hee hee all trrolling aside. I hardly ever speak out on issues like this. I just couldnt help but remember the Cover fur Spiderman #1 back in the 90'a that Todd McFarlane did when you pointed to GW's peice as a source of blatant referencing. Image can be found here.

http://babakkabab.tripod.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/gallery10web.jpg

I guess I have no real point tho... it's almost 3 am and am easily amused
(Deleted comment)
acrimonius
Jul. 24th, 2005 08:14 am (UTC)
Click. Ha ha, I beat you.
acrimonius
Jul. 24th, 2005 08:16 am (UTC)
And, er, okay, you couldn't have known this, but I've said everything I've said here to her face multiple times, but I don't draw pretty enough to have her attention. :P
(Deleted comment)
acrimonius
Jul. 24th, 2005 08:21 am (UTC)
... Thaaaaaaaaat I've said everything I've said here to her face on multiple occasions, but she never listens to me. Glad to see we're all on the same page here!
rahni
Jul. 24th, 2005 08:00 pm (UTC)
It's not that original of a pose:/ I'm sure you could look around in old Marvel or DC comics depicting monsters find find similar poses from werewolves. I wouldn't nit-pick too much about it...
larylich
Jul. 24th, 2005 09:43 am (UTC)
If by "drama" she meant "getting pressured to produce the art you agreed to and got paid for" then too bad. Be professional if you take the cash.

I'm a slow artist. I let my clients know this up front. However I keep them VERY well informed on the state of their commission and walk them through the process. Silence = bad times for a client, and I've found that most folks are understanding when things take a while if you keep them in the loop.
( 20 comments — Leave a comment )

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