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WHO: Ganador / Flashdust Lamington (On Second Life)
WHAT: Selling of a Latin Vixen (http://www.mixedcandy.com) blue dragon partial fursuit: http://mixedcandymascots.com/gallery/v/dragons/bluedragon/
WHEN: Start Date: Jun 14, 2007
PRICE:Total to be $750 (he said the price changed on him? Yeah its called PAY PAL FEE AND SHIPPING!)
PROBLEM: Since 2007 Last payment of $150 was never sent. He said that the fursuit was crushed, but never gave me any proof of that (no pictures, etc), but I found him wearing that fursuit at a fursuit only weeks later.

After talking to friends, they said don't bother with Small Claims court, so I decided I would at least bring this up here as a warning about Ganador. I don't expect to get any money from him about this, but just wanted to blow off some steam. Thanks for reading.




---------------------------------------------------------------------
FIRST PAYMENT ON PAYPAL THROUGH HIS FRIEND AARON Z:
Payment Received (Unique Transaction ID #0UL40107R4111143V)

Sent by: Aaron Zxxxx
Buyer Email: aaron@xxxx.com
Payment Sent to:dia@xxxx.net

Amount received: $600.00 USD
Fee amount: -$17.70 USD
Net amount: $582.30 USD

Date: Jun 14, 2007
Time: 15:04:38 PDT
Status: Completed

Subject: Aaron Zxxxxx
Payment Type: Instant

---------------------------------------------------------------------
TIME LINE:

On Thu, June 14, 2007 5:10 pm
--- dia@xxxxx wrote:

Ok, I received your payment. Thank you.

Ganny:
Please send me the address you want me to send the costume to.

Also, using PayPal costs a Fee too, that royally sucks:
Total Amount: $600.00 USD
Fee Amount: -$17.70 USD
Net Amount: $582.30 USD

So, I have to add on another $30 ($15 x 2 I just rolled it down instead of up for even numbers with the $150 (100 payment plus 50 for shipping)to cover all the fees and shipping as well.

So$180 will still be coming after AC, I assume?

Aaron, Thanks for helping out with this!
-Jen


-----------------------------------------------------
On Thu, June 14, 2007 5:29 pm, Ganador wrote:

*confoozled* if the price for using paypal is 17.70
then instead of sending 150 after AC, i should be sending 150, and an extra 17.70, right?

the adress is:
XXXX
XXXX
Waltham, MA 02451

if you need anything else luv let me know
*nuzzles* i miss you!


-----------------------------------------------------
On Thu, June 14, 2007 5:42 pm, Ganador wrote:

paypal is so dumb for trying to steal munny. its ok, ill pay whatever they try and take
*nuzzles affectionately*


--- dia@xxxx wrote:
Two payments = two fees :( I dont know what hte second fee will be first one was 17.70, next time will be based on the next payment total.

-J


-----------------------------------------------------

Fri, June 15, 2007 12:33 pm

i got your text, here is the adress again incase you didnt get it in the other email

XXXX
XXXX
Waltham, MA 02451

let me know who your using to send it, and the tracking number, so i can coordinate my schedule and be home when the mailman gets there.

*snuggles her tight, missing her, daydreaming about when he first got into costume for her*


--- dia@xxxxx wrote:
*snugs* i am sure you will love being dragony at AC.
have fun at hte con.
-J




-----------------------------------------------------
On Thu, June 14, 2007 5:29 pm, Ganador wrote:

*confoozled* if the price for using paypal is 17.70
then instead of sending 150 after AC, i should be sending 150, and an extra 17.70, right?

the adress is:
XXXX
XXXX
Waltham, MA 02451

if you need anything else luv let me know
*nuzzles* i miss you!



--- dia@xxxxx wrote:
Ok, I received your payment. Thank you.

Ganny:
Please send me the address you want me to send the costume to.

Also, using PayPal costs a Fee too, that royally sucks:
Total Amount: $600.00 USD
Fee Amount: -$17.70 USD
Net Amount: $582.30 USD

So, I have to add on another $30 ($15 x 2 I just rolled it down instead of up for even numbers with the $150 (100 payment plus 50 for shipping)to cover all the fees and shipping as well.

So$180 will still be coming after AC, I assume?

Aaron, Thanks for helping out with this!
-Jen

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Several times through 2008 / 2009 and /2010 I talked to Ganador on AIM, Second Life, etc but, unfortunately AIM at in 2008 didn't log, but I have some from 2009 and 2010 Second Life below

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fri, October 2, 2009 1:50 pm

Gan,
OK, this is officially pissing me off.
You still owe me $150 for the dragon costume you "bought" from me.

I am on the verse of possibly bringing you to Small Claims Court (yes,
eventhough we are in different statesit doesn't matter) since I have your
real name and address, to get my last payment from you. I also have proof
of the sale below.

See the ancient email below. I have tried contacting you on here, FA,
AIM, and SL, with no luck. I don't care HOW you get the money, just find
$150 and send it to my paypal dia@xxxxx and I will leave you be.

Get a hold of me IMMEDIATELY.
-Jen



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
FROM SECOND LIFE (note that some of the Non-Fursuit-part of these conversations were removed):

-- Instant message logging enabled --
[2009/08/22 21:52] Flashdust Lamington is Online
[21:59] Diadexxus Maelstrom: hi stranger.
[22:01] Flashdust Lamington: hey love. howve things been with you? havent heard from you in awhile
[22:01] Diadexxus Maelstrom: you havent exactly been around.
[22:03] Diadexxus Maelstrom: was trying to log into Xanadu but I cant TP into it
>>>SNIP<<<
[22:19] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I am sorry if my email gave you more Stress, but I thought it was only fair that I bring up the $150 still owed me for the dragon you keep wearing :(
[22:20] Flashdust Lamington: your email? O.o you havent emailed me since the dawn of time
[22:21] Flashdust Lamington: and i dont even remember the subject of the last email you sent. it was ages agp
[22:22] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I emailed last week I believe.
[22:23] Flashdust Lamington: im sorry if i didnt see it, ill check
[22:23] Diadexxus Maelstrom: saying I am extremely upset that you havent paid off the last $150 of the draogn you keep wearing, for 3 years :(
[22:23] Diadexxus Maelstrom: A LOT of people have not paid me back in the last 5 years, and well its annoying
[22:23] Flashdust Lamington: as for the 150, your absolutely right. though i must admit i secretly felt upset at you in return for a few things
[22:25] Flashdust Lamington: not only what you did with jen, but when you first offered the suit you offered a certain price. i dont even remember what it was. but i do remember later on you wanted 150 more than that price. changing the number on me. and making me feel a bit offended when you said "no i didnt say this much, i said that much" when i remember perfectly clearly. the price didnt change until i said id take it. but i never braught it up. your a very stubborn woman, and can be very bitchy. so i never used to btoher ever telling you if something you did made me uncomfortable. which isnt healthy
[22:26] Flashdust Lamington: atop this, when you sentr the suit in a box, it was crushed. the other parts didnt matter. but the head itself was smooshed. in a way that broke the jaw, and caiused the muzzle to be bent to the side, i fixed it later with help, but from then on the face had creases that can not be undone
[22:26] Flashdust Lamington: however the jaw is fixed. glue and stitching and a peice of spandex helped it just fine
[22:27] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I have the original emails if you would like to read that you agreed to a certain amount, and proof of what you have given...?
[22:28] Flashdust Lamington: oh no, the original amount as verbally given when you very first said you might sell it.
[22:28] Flashdust Lamington: not in emails
[22:28] Diadexxus Maelstrom: you never brought up the fact that it was crushed? I packed it perfectly fine.
[22:28] Diadexxus Maelstrom: *might* and *do* selling are two differnt things.. you agreed to a final price of a *do* selling.
[22:28] Flashdust Lamington: only after i confirmed id like to take it, did we begin talking in emails on it, and the price changed. though i didnt say a word
[22:28] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I was stupid and didnt get the whole amount before sending it.
[22:29] Flashdust Lamington: as for bringing up the fact it was crushed, yes i did say so. over the phone with you
[22:29] Flashdust Lamington: and as for might, your words were "i might be willing to sell it. if i do, it would be for this much"
[22:29] Diadexxus Maelstrom: You have been wearing it with no problem for 3 years.
[22:30] Diadexxus Maelstrom: Verbal doesnt hold up in court...
[22:30] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I dont want it to become nasty (ie: taking it to court) I just want what is due me...and has been for 3 years while you still wear him.
[22:31] Flashdust Lamington: yes no problems after fixing it. and of course verbal does not hold up in court. but you actually mean to threaten me with some sort of court issue? like small claims or something like that?
[22:31] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I couldnt tell you what I said verbally, only what I have emails saying.
[22:32] Diadexxus Maelstrom: well, just saying, you seem to have plenty of money going to several cons over the last 3 years...even Califur!
[22:32] Flashdust Lamington: my money sources are my own affair. i go to cons out of trading avatar work
[22:33] Flashdust Lamington: i tried asking a friend in san jose for advice about this stuff
[22:33] Flashdust Lamington: only time i ever confided in someone any info about you
[22:33] Flashdust Lamington: their response was that theyve known you for ages and your very "me me me". which didnt help me at all. that wasnt even advice. so it only frustrated me more
[22:34] Diadexxus Maelstrom: heh, and I should tell you what I have heard about you too, my friend...
[22:34] Flashdust Lamington: oh im sure ive heard it all
[22:34] Diadexxus Maelstrom: Lets not get nasty. Just send me my money that is owed, and it will be done.
[22:35] Flashdust Lamington: just sitting here listening to you while also listening to my coders try to explain why our animations are suddenly acting funny and its 1:30am for me
[22:35] Diadexxus Maelstrom: we dont even have to stay friends if you dont want. I just want to have what is owed for 3 years. I am tired of waiting.
[22:36] Flashdust Lamington: i honestly dont know what i want as far as friends are concerned. because i miss you and still like you. but i also feel uncomfortable around you because of what you did, and because i beleive your friends are right. so its confusing for me. not to mention the fact im still a bit heartbroken
[22:36] Diadexxus Maelstrom: well goodnight then.
[22:37] Flashdust Lamington: im not here to fight
[22:37] Flashdust Lamington: i put up no fight with you and feel no threat. which is why i can finally be honest
[22:41] Flashdust Lamington: if you want a punching bag you got the wrong guy
[22:41] Diadexxus Maelstrom: well I am glad you dont hate me. I dont like being hated.
[22:41] Diadexxus Maelstrom: THough, I dont like being walked on either
[22:42] Diadexxus Maelstrom: Ganny, Seriously, just PayPal the $, and that will be it.. If we end up seeing eachother in person, I will be nice, etc..but it wont ever be what it was.
[22:43] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I mean, hell I saw both of you at FC and things were fine
[22:44] Flashdust Lamington: i dont like being walked on either dia. and paperwork aside i felt changing the price on me last minute when i finally said i would like to take it, and then the face being crushed where i had to ask the lemur to help me fix the jaw and the bent face, makes me feel walked on
[22:44] Flashdust Lamington: and yes we were fine, because no matter what i have the power to be friends
[22:44] Diadexxus Maelstrom: So, you dont plan on paying me the last payment of $150?
[22:45] Flashdust Lamington: i dont know how much extra your asking for right now but i do remember you originally telling me you wanted 600 for it
[22:45] Diadexxus Maelstrom: BTW, LV's partials go for over $1500.
[22:45] Diadexxus Maelstrom: you got a DEAL on him
[22:45] Flashdust Lamington: they do now yes
[22:45] Diadexxus Maelstrom: go look at her prices on the website.
[22:45] Flashdust Lamington: and you told me ytou braught it from some guy and it was too big for you and you didnt pay 1500 for it
[22:45] Diadexxus Maelstrom: and yours would sell right up there because its so cute
[22:46] Flashdust Lamington: and at that time, her partials went for 900
[22:46] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I paid something like $900
[22:46] Diadexxus Maelstrom: still even if you paid $800 you got a deal
[22:46] Flashdust Lamington: no need, dont forget we are personal friendw with her here
[22:46] Diadexxus Maelstrom: who is? you?
[22:46] Flashdust Lamington: and you told me you paied 750 for it or something
[22:47] Flashdust Lamington: you is "me and jen"
[22:47] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I dont remember, as I said, I would have to go look and see what I actually paid.
[22:47] Flashdust Lamington: i knew what her patials wnet for back then
[22:47] Flashdust Lamington: which is why when you said 600 i thought that was great
[22:47] Flashdust Lamington: and tryd to put it together for you
[22:47] Diadexxus Maelstrom: but, I dont care. The fact is, you keep wearing him, and I havent been completely paid per what you agreed on an email.
[22:47] Flashdust Lamington: but i think i was only able to give you like 550 or something
[22:47] Flashdust Lamington: because paypal ate 50 bucks
[22:47] Flashdust Lamington: for some sort of tax or something
[22:48] Diadexxus Maelstrom: give it as a "Gift" and tey dont take anything
[22:48] Diadexxus Maelstrom: dia@xxxx.xxx if you come up with the money
[22:48] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I am outta here. I am gong to bed.
[22:49] Diadexxus Maelstrom: but, please, dont let me keep bothering you about stuff. send it soon. Thanks Ganny


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[2009/10/12 22:45] Flashdust Lamington is Online.
[2009/10/12 22:46] Diadexxus Maelstrom: still even if you paid $800 you got a deal
[2009/10/12 22:46] Flashdust Lamington: no need, dont forget we are personal friendw with her here
[2009/10/12 22:46] Diadexxus Maelstrom: who is? you?
[2009/10/12 22:46] Flashdust Lamington: and you told me you paied 750 for it or something
[2009/10/12 22:47] Flashdust Lamington: you is "me and jen"
[2009/10/12 22:47] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I dont remember, as I said, I would have to go look and see what I actually paid.
[2009/10/12 22:47] Flashdust Lamington: i knew what her patials wnet for back then
[2009/10/12 22:47] Flashdust Lamington: which is why when you said 600 i thought that was great
[2009/10/12 22:47] Flashdust Lamington: and tryd to put it together for you
[2009/10/12 22:47] Diadexxus Maelstrom: but, I dont care. The fact is, you keep wearing him, and I havent been completely paid per what you agreed on an email.
[2009/10/12 22:47] Flashdust Lamington: but i think i was only able to give you like 550 or something
[2009/10/12 22:47] Flashdust Lamington: because paypal ate 50 bucks
[2009/10/12 22:47] Flashdust Lamington: for some sort of tax or something
[2009/10/12 22:48] Diadexxus Maelstrom: give it as a "Gift" and tey dont take anything
[2009/10/12 22:48] Diadexxus Maelstrom: dia@xxxxx if you come up with the money
[2009/10/12 22:48] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I am outta here. I am gong to bed.
[2009/10/12 22:48] Flashdust Lamington: night
[2009/10/12 22:48] Flashdust Lamington: hope you like xanadu
[2009/10/12 22:49] Flashdust Lamington: and WKRP in Cincinnatti
[2009/10/12 22:49] Diadexxus Maelstrom: its pretty nic
[2009/10/12 22:49] Diadexxus Maelstrom: nice.
[2009/10/12 22:49] Diadexxus Maelstrom: but, please, dont let me keep bothering you about stuff. send it soon. Thanks Ganny

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-- Instant message logging enabled --
[2010/10/09 20:42] Flashdust Lamington is Online.
[2010/10/09 20:42] Diadexxus Maelstrom: hey stranger!
[20:43] Flashdust Lamington: heya!
[20:46] Diadexxus Maelstrom: Though, hon, you still owe me a few bucks for the Dragon Fursuit :( and you never got back to me
[20:47] Flashdust Lamington: we already spoke about that. i made it clear that what i payed you was it, and that i still felt miffed about it being kinda damaged in transistion. you then got very angry and loud saying youll take me to court. so i said ok.
[20:47] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I never said OK
[20:48] Flashdust Lamington: no, im the one who said ok
[20:48] Diadexxus Maelstrom: $150 is still owed. And unfortunately, if I have to I can go to court for it.
[20:48] Flashdust Lamington: re-read my post
[20:48] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I have all the emails.
[20:48] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I really hate being so pissed about this, but I dont like being shorted.
[20:48] Diadexxus Maelstrom: and you still wear the dragon at every con you go to
[20:50] Flashdust Lamington: of course i still wear it. i spent time repairing it, and enjoy making people smile. but like i said, i felt shorted myself when i found it damaged in transition, and it wasnt adressed. but thats fine by me its ok im not angry. but i already made it clear before that i am no longer speaking on the subject. you asked me directly months ago if i am clearly stating i will not pay the final 150, and i said that is correct.
[20:51] Diadexxus Maelstrom: if you didnt want it, you shoudl have resent it, you NEVER mentioned it damanaged
[20:51] Diadexxus Maelstrom: *gathering information and will set it up in a small claims court.
[20:51] Diadexxus Maelstrom: Thanks
[20:51] Flashdust Lamington: im not pissed. im not angry. i did repair it myself and no i am not paying the remaining 150. all things i said, over a year ago i beleive. and yes, i did mention it damaged. only the head, not the rest of course
[20:52] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I do not have any info of any damage.
[20:52] Diadexxus Maelstrom: No emails nothing
[20:52] Flashdust Lamington: dia you havent contacted me in ages. i already told you before, if you want to go to court over the remaining 150, thats up to you, but dont hasle me otherwise. its almost harrassment. at least thats how it feels to me. these are all things we spoke about and adressed over a year back. over the phone and here in SL.
[20:52] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I have the emails of the payments you DID do and the last one you said you would going to do and never did
[20:52] Diadexxus Maelstrom: now I have this that you say you are ignoring
[20:53] Diadexxus Maelstrom: Thanks a lot Ganador, you are a big nothing.
[20:53] Flashdust Lamington: and of course you have no emails on damage i spoke to you directly on the phone. dont forget at the time we were much closer and in constant contact
[20:53] Flashdust Lamington: none of this is new information
[20:53] Diadexxus Maelstrom: You are right, I have been WAITING for MONTHS
[20:53] Diadexxus Maelstrom: YEARS now, for that last payment of $150
[20:54] Flashdust Lamington: im not here to argue, or call names. or make threats. i am speaking calmly and clearly when i say, "we adressed this before over a year ago. i already made my intentions clear. you said youd take it to court, became irate, made threats. i simply said ok. and awaited further instruction. and never heard from you since"
[20:54] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I am glad I kept the emails with the payments you did pay, and me sending the suit and you owing me $150.
[20:54] Diadexxus Maelstrom: And I am asking for the $150 you still owe. ANd well if it sounds like a threat, Small Claims it is.
[20:54] Flashdust Lamington: please do what you feel is best dia. but please, no more arguments. no fighting.
[20:54] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I have your full name and address... shouldnt be too difficult
[20:55] Diadexxus Maelstrom: $150 would stop EVERYTHING. The last payment is owed. Thats it.
[20:55] Diadexxus Maelstrom: Then you will never hear from me ever again.
[20:55] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I dotn evenWANT to talk to you anymore over this.
[20:57] Flashdust Lamington: and as i already told you more than once, both here in SL and on the phone. Im not paying the last 150. the head arrived damaged due to being smooshed by the tail and the left foot, in a box a bit too small for the contents. which is ok, i repaired it, theres a couple things i couldnt fix but thats ok. im not upset, but im also not paying the final 150. i dont know how many times i need to repeat myself. these are all things i said over a year ago
[20:57] Diadexxus Maelstrom: YouNEVER brought up ANY DAMAGE!!!
[20:57] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I would have just asked for it back
[20:57] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I woudl have fixed it and sold it else where, it was a Latin Vixen suit and would EASILY have sold it for more than you bought it for.. you got it for a STEAL
[20:59] Flashdust Lamington: dia, here is a small peice of log from the last time we had a conversation like this
[20:59] Flashdust Lamington: which is strangely, about one year ago. october 13th 2009
[20:59] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I figured its been ab out that much, since I found you online I watched to catch and ask you about it...
[20:59] Diadexxus Maelstrom: since its been a TON of time between
[21:00] Flashdust Lamington: [22:26] Flashdust Lamington: atop this, when you sentr the suit in a box, it was crushed. the other parts didnt matter. but the head itself was smooshed. in a way that broke the jaw, and caiused the muzzle to be bent to the side, i fixed it later with help, but from then on the face had creases that can not be undone
[22:26] Flashdust Lamington: however the jaw is fixed. glue and stitching and a peice of spandex helped it just fine
[22:27] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I have the original emails if you would like to read that you agreed to a certain amount, and proof of what you have given...?
[21:00] Flashdust Lamington: our last conversation like this, was similar to this one. me mentioning why i am not paying the final 150. speaking of the damage to the head. and you claiming i never mentiuoned it before
[21:01] Flashdust Lamington: now today you claim again that i never mentioned it. but here i have logged proof of us speaking about it one year ago
[21:01] Diadexxus Maelstrom: Then send me the money owed to me.
[21:01] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I never said you can just HAVE it without the $150 owed
[21:01] Diadexxus Maelstrom: did I?
[21:01] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I dont think so
[21:01] Diadexxus Maelstrom: if I didnt I wouldnt have been making a big deal about it
[21:01] Diadexxus Maelstrom: I jsut think its slimey that you havent paid off the fursuit
[21:01] Diadexxus Maelstrom: when you got it for cheap to start with
[21:02] Flashdust Lamington: yes dia you did claim i never spoke of it. i have the logs here
[21:02] Flashdust Lamington: [22:28] Diadexxus Maelstrom: you never brought up the fact that it was crushed? I packed it perfectly fine.
[21:03] Diadexxus Maelstrom: SEE!?>!? I even brought up the fact that it was packed perfectly FINE
[21:03] Diadexxus Maelstrom: you certainly never sent me a picture of the crushed box OR the head amaage
[21:03] Diadexxus Maelstrom: That may be the case that you mentioned it a YEAR ago, but not RIGHT when yo ugot hte box...
[21:04] Flashdust Lamington: claiming it was packed fine doesnt change anything diua. and your changing the subject, eluding the reason i pasted that excerpt
[21:04] Flashdust Lamington: and right when i got the box i mentioned it, by calling you to let you know it arrived, and tell you
[21:04] Flashdust Lamington: which you brushed off by saying i could just fix it, and then asking when more money is coming
[21:04] Flashdust Lamington: i just proved to you, that your wrong about "never speaking about this before"
[21:04] Diadexxus Maelstrom: OK, proof that I NEVER said it was OK to jipt me out of $150 that was owed me
[21:05] Flashdust Lamington: in black and white. which calls to doubt other things you may say.
[21:05] Diadexxus Maelstrom: But, I never said it was OK to Jipt me out of $150. Did I? I never said "Please ignore the last payment"
[21:06] Diadexxus Maelstrom: YOU DECIDED TO KEEP THE SUIT, which means you should PAY IT IN FULL
[21:06] Flashdust Lamington: and it doesnt matter to me whether you are "ok" with me not paying the final 150. you became irate and made threats, and i simply said ok. no attitude from me. do what you think is best dia. but i dont want to argue. as i said multiple times, but still seem to end up in this disscussion.
[21:06] Diadexxus Maelstrom: OK, SO be it. I will be collecting all these messages including emails and contacting Small Claims Court soon.
[21:07] Diadexxus Maelstrom: Then it will be $150 PLUS price of Small Claims Court
[21:07] Diadexxus Maelstrom: you nevever even offered to make small payments to pay it off... which blows me away
[21:07] Flashdust Lamington: this is what you told me you would do, over a year ago. and again my response now is no different than it was then: and that is to do what you think is best.
Artist's beware has moved!
Do NOT repost your old bewares. They are being archived.
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Comments

( 112 comments — Leave a comment )
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silverfalln
Oct. 23rd, 2010 05:35 am (UTC)
Just FYI: According to PayPal's ToU, you -cannot- (openly) charge a customer for the fees. You can roll them into "Shipping and Handling" but not say "Look, I'm using this service, and you have to pay for it." Every time you use a card, credit or debit, at a store, you are costing that store a fee, since all card companies charge for credit cards. They roll those fees into their prices.

He could, if he wanted, report your account for saying he has to cover the fee.
diadexxus
Oct. 23rd, 2010 06:19 am (UTC)
You are correct.
See my comment below... as of 2007, I didn't know if that was the case, as of 2009, I knew that. But, Still he had shipping to still pay.

-J
(no subject) - diadexxus - Oct. 23rd, 2010 06:35 am (UTC) - Expand
snippetchick
Oct. 23rd, 2010 05:37 am (UTC)
Hmm.
I always thought that Paypal doesn't allow people to add on the paypal fees when charging for things.

Postage on the other hand, and paying what he owes is entirely reasonable!
celestinaketzia
Oct. 23rd, 2010 03:49 pm (UTC)
You cannot charge people for PP fees. You will get your account into trouble if you do so.
(no subject) - vaekke - Oct. 23rd, 2010 04:52 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - celestinaketzia - Oct. 23rd, 2010 05:59 pm (UTC) - Expand
(Deleted comment)
(no subject) - celestinaketzia - Oct. 24th, 2010 12:49 pm (UTC) - Expand
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xianjaguar
Oct. 23rd, 2010 05:46 am (UTC)
Seems like both people are at fault here.

Ganador is at fault for not paying the remainder of the money owed, but the OP is at fault TOO, for two things:
1) For charging a PayPal "Fee" which is totally AGAINST PayPal's TOS, and 2) for then suggesting to send the money as a 'gift' to avoid the fee, which is ALSO against PayPal's TOS. ([2009/10/12 22:48] Diadexxus Maelstrom: give it as a "Gift" and tey dont take anything)

Seriously as a seller who accepts PayPal, you should abide by their rules. If you need to cover the fee's cost, then charge more for the suit or your services from the beginning (roll it into your "cost of doing business"). NEVER ask for more money to specifically cover PayPal fees, it's against the PayPal rules, and don't ask people to send money as a "gift" for services or products that are "sold".

(edited for formatting fail)

Edited at 2010-10-23 05:49 am (UTC)
diadexxus
Oct. 23rd, 2010 06:17 am (UTC)
True, I didn't realize at the time in 2007, that doing this was a problem...
I do now (as of 2009)
-J
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youthculture
Oct. 23rd, 2010 05:56 am (UTC)
wow. this post is incredibly invasive to ganador's personal life, and i don't even know the dude.

screenshots and quotes are one thing, but there's some stuff we Don't Need To Know.
diadexxus
Oct. 23rd, 2010 06:17 am (UTC)
Trust me, I tried to take the personal stuff out (as we did talk about other stuff in SL)
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(Screened comment)
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poprock_grey
Oct. 23rd, 2010 06:13 am (UTC)
Regardless, I think you should take him/her to small claims. This is a lot of money (To me at least), and even if you did the paypal things, you still would be owed money.



diadexxus
Oct. 23rd, 2010 06:25 am (UTC)
After 3 years, I am giving up. $150 isn't worth the stress / time it would take TO get him there. Thanks for your support though!!
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cesarin
Oct. 23rd, 2010 06:22 am (UTC)
I only hope he doesnt try to push his infamous "popularity" or Jen(spunky's) popularity to try to burn you.
diadexxus
Oct. 23rd, 2010 06:24 am (UTC)
*laugh* Infamous. Good word there ;)

Spunky is an awesome person, I have no bad feelings toward here at all. She is great.
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celarania
Oct. 23rd, 2010 06:46 am (UTC)
My best advice on this situation is to compromise and I'll second the bit about lots of personal information in this post. He sent you $600, which you say (as far as I can gather) is not as much as you say you agreed upon for the costume. I would say to just say that you'll agree to the reduced price as a concession because it was damaged. Do not go into whether you doubt him or not at this point (it'll only reflect badly on you). However, say that you would appreciate the $50 shipping. If he has a problem with this, point out that it's the same price as it would be if you sold it for $600 + $50 shipping. As for you, you will get $50, which is a nice bit of pocket money, and it would be completely fair to refund him $100 if the costume was indeed damaged.

I have a feeling this situation will be so muddled that it's going to be hard to find a 'right' side, so at this point I think it's best to look for a solution that will leave both parties as happy as possible. That seems like it'll be the $600+$50 S&H. However, I do realize that it may also be too late to resolve the situation at this time, but this community doubles as a resource for other artists, so it might help someone eles.
diadexxus
Oct. 23rd, 2010 06:51 am (UTC)
He received the suit 3 years ago and at that time he never sent proof of it it being crushed / damaged to me. (pictures, etc) Just TELLING me it was. I saw it later that year and it was in fine shape.

But, its 3 years out, if you saw my comments, I have given up on trying to get any money from him at this time.

It IS far too late to resolve, so again, I give up.
Again, I only put this as a warning to others about him.

-J
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maddogairpirate
Oct. 23rd, 2010 09:36 am (UTC)
So this guy admits he didn't pay you, that I see. He then talks about being upset about Jen (which I don't get... you're Jen, but in NO WAY undoes the money owed. Maybe it's just poor wording on his part) and then talks about the suit being crushed. Which is didn't mention to you, and he has been wearing this suit around?

Any chance we have an image of him in the suit? Because that would be the final nail in the coffin if you ask me. No mention of the crush, no sign of the crush if the picture reveals that, and that would make this guy a total deadbeat for that 150.

Edit: Ah, so he said crushed, but didn't show pics. Still not your problem. You can't address what you can't see.

Edited at 2010-10-23 09:41 am (UTC)
casteddreams
Oct. 23rd, 2010 12:24 pm (UTC)
I believe when he mentioned Jen, he was referring to his own girlfriend, Spunky, whose name is also Jen. I'm pretty sure, anyway.
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skanrashke
Oct. 23rd, 2010 10:23 am (UTC)
Grab him at a con. Be like.
Dude. Gimme 150 or I'm takin that suit back.
And if hes like OMG YOU CANT DO THAT LOLOLOL ITS IN MY HOTEL ROOM
Just go into his room and bloody take it.
Mature? No. Handled properly? No. But if its not paid for(And shipping/paypal/misc fees aside he still owes 100 on it) its still YOUR property.
foxiii
Oct. 23rd, 2010 10:39 am (UTC)
I think that is what OJ's in the pen for!
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lilenth
Oct. 23rd, 2010 12:06 pm (UTC)

Threatening him with small claims doesn't mean a thing unless you back it up with action. He should have paid you (paypal fee issues aside) but you shouldn't have sent it without it being fully paid and you shouldn't have threatened but done it, he'd have probably paid up if he thought you were actually going to do it. Empty threats do nothing, either do it or don't do it.
skanrashke
Oct. 23rd, 2010 01:30 pm (UTC)
This 100%. If you want either your money or the costume back, you have to take him to court or find a way of getting it back while reimbursing him for what he has already paid you, regardless of paypal fees, etc- just the flat amount of whats been paid so far so there's no hassle over it. I have no idea how you'd go about doing this without some kind of horrible explosion.

If he has a gf/bf you could try talking to them?
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celestinaketzia
Oct. 23rd, 2010 04:09 pm (UTC)
So, let me get this right. You told him $600 initially, and the $750 total comes from PP fees and Shipping, correct?

Well, you cannot charge for PP fees at all, so technically, all he still owes you for is shipping. So, however much you paid to ship that thing is all he still owes you.

Just the mere fact that you wanted him to send it as a Gift and wanted him to pay your fees is enough for him to report you to PayPal and have your account in hot water.

Edit: And now that you know you cannot charge him for PP fees, I don't think you should be hassling him for the full $150. Still wanting the full amount still says that you do, in fact, want him to cover your fees and he can still report you for that.

Edited at 2010-10-23 04:11 pm (UTC)
onfourwejump
Oct. 24th, 2010 01:08 am (UTC)
Pretty much this.

Part of me thinks the OP is giving up because she knows she partially in the wrong for trying to get the rest of it, and what the shipping was wouldn't be worth taking him to small claims.

Also, why she even shipped it when shipping wasn't paid is beyond me. That's asking to get ripped off.

Live and learn.
(Deleted comment)
mandyseley
Oct. 23rd, 2010 04:52 pm (UTC)
Agreed entirely.

I also think it's pretty bad that PayPal fees were never even mentioned until after the first payment. I get that the rules about WHO should pay the fees were misunderstood at the time, but apparently no one even realized they existed? I'd feel cheated, too, if a seller told me AFTER my first payment "Oh yeah, and you'll need to pay X more dollars to cover fees."

I'm not saying it's okay that Ganador didn't make the shipping payment at all, but I don't see that this was handled very well on EITHER side of things, I'm afraid...
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stormslegacy
Oct. 23rd, 2010 07:13 pm (UTC)
I'm gonna jump on the bandwagon and say that this post comes off as very unprofessional.

For one, the gift button SAYS IN THE TEXT that it cannot be used to circumvent fees for transactions. I don't think previous ignorance is an excuse..I mean it's obviously wrong to misuse it if you give it even a modicum of thought.

Second, verbal agreements are hard to prove, but are legally binding and CAN be held up in court, if the judge feels that it would be a reasonable/likely thing to have said. I don't think changing the price is OK, and in the convos you told him that he didn't have a leg to stand on, rather than deny it. That rubs me significantly the wrong way. That and the damage. You're very dismissive of him, and responding "you could fix that" is not the way to handle things like that.

I don't like that he was passive aggressive by not sending the money but I think that if he pays you the $50 shipping that alone should cover it--It's also a very easy problem to avoid by just waiting for the full amount before sending. I wouldn't avoid him based on your beware, I'd most likely avoid *you.* I'm getting the impression that you're having seller's remorse because Mixed Candy suits have gone up in price.
obsidianwolfess
Oct. 23rd, 2010 07:19 pm (UTC)
I'm getting the impression that you're having seller's remorse because Mixed Candy suits have gone up in price.

Hate to say it, but.. I agree with this statement.

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anjel_kitty
Oct. 23rd, 2010 08:39 pm (UTC)
Was this guy your friend, or do you interact with all your customers with the murry purry BS? Ugh that is just annoying to read I could barely even keep focus on the task at hand.
I think you should take this as a learning experience in that never ship a product till you have the full amount in hand, but also that if you conduct business with someone, make sure they take you seriously and not establish some sort of pseudo roleplay furry interplay between the two of you. That's all well and fine demeanor your friends, but try to keep a more professional demeanor in dealing with people you deal with in a financial capacity.

(Deleted comment)
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duster
Oct. 23rd, 2010 09:20 pm (UTC)
I couldn't even get past all the obnoxious murrypurry RPing to get to the point. I really hope you don't do this with all your customers because it's very unprofessional. If I were working with you that would grate on my nerves so fast.

This just sounds like a friendship that went bad and now you're putting this up out of spite to get back at him. First you violate Paypal's ToS (and how could you not know about the no gifting to get around fees rule, it's on the gifting page) and then you keep threatening him with lawsuits and throwing passive aggressive childish rants at him.

I'd never commission you or him, you both seem unbearable. I love two for one deals on A_B.
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