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A commissioner I have some issues with

Just posting here to let everyone know, do not accept a commission from this person! Unless you enjoy having your work re-edited, without your approval, that is.

I'm talking about the commissioner named Frisky-Lime. Dunno if he has an LJ, but that's his FA.

I live with the artist called Crys the Hybrid, and Frisky bought a commission from her. Let me make it know, he lives here, too, by the by.

Crys worked on his picture for 2 days solid, from 10am to around 8pm, and went from sketch to full color in that time. So she shows Frisky, and he says it's good to go. So she e-mails it to him, and he thanks her and goes to his room, theoretically to post it to his FA.

I go in there after a while to go to the bathroom, which is IN his bedroom, and catch a glimpse of his computer. He's been in his room for the last few hours, editing the picture Crys spent so long on.

In the end, he recolored the whole thing, redrew certain bits, and added several things that Crys never drew. And when I asked him why he did it, he said "I'm really picky about my art."

To which I wanted to reply, "Then edit YOUR OWN art!" And also, "Then why do you buy commissions?"

The latter of which was actually spoken, and he said, "Because I like getting art!"

>.< I, for one, will never accept a commission from this guy, after this crap. He literally saw NOTHING wrong with his actions. In fact, he thinks he's "improved" the picture.

Needless to say, I disagree.

So, yeah. Here's my warning: Do NOT accept a commission from this person, if you want any sort of respect for the work you put in on his art, because he will, in all likelihood (he's done this before, but not quite so drastically) immediately edit your work.

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Comments

( 116 comments — Leave a comment )
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mpd_84
Dec. 4th, 2009 06:31 am (UTC)
have you talked to Crys about this?
yokofox
Dec. 4th, 2009 05:57 pm (UTC)
Yeah, she was really upset by him editing her art. He told her it looked fine, like I said, and then went and edited it without permission or even saying anything til it was done.
fuzibuni
Dec. 4th, 2009 06:35 am (UTC)
Well... in my eyes, he did buy it. He can do what he likes with it really, as long as he doesn't claim it as his own work. He may enjoy doing the little edits??
thaily
Dec. 4th, 2009 06:50 am (UTC)
He bought it, but he didn't buy the rights to it.
So.. Technically you're not allowed to make a derivative product thereof.
(no subject) - maddogairpirate - Dec. 4th, 2009 06:52 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - thaily - Dec. 4th, 2009 06:56 am (UTC) - Expand
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(no subject) - thaily - Dec. 4th, 2009 08:35 pm (UTC) - Expand
alexds1
Dec. 4th, 2009 06:41 am (UTC)
Did he pay for the art prior to edits? If so, its his property, and he can really do whatever he wants to it as long as he isn't blatantly claiming the entire work is his own...

And maybe its not my place to say, but this sounds like the sort of thing you can communicate to the person directly, since you live with them and don't suffer from a complete communication breakdown like for so many other postings on this comm. This whole post seems unnecessarily dramatic.
maddogairpirate
Dec. 4th, 2009 06:41 am (UTC)
Forgive me for being blunt, but I'll say what I'm thinking.

So what? Unless he's claiming the work solely as his own, there's no foul here.
yokofox
Dec. 4th, 2009 06:05 pm (UTC)
Well, I only posted this to let people know, since it's very rude, I think. And isn't that what this community is about? Warning artists about rude/bad/lying commissioners?

But in all honesty, it really did upset my friend. And her husband. So, I figured I'd let people know.
(no subject) - fiercereaper - Dec. 4th, 2009 09:59 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - yokofox - Dec. 5th, 2009 02:31 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - fiercereaper - Dec. 5th, 2009 02:36 am (UTC) - Expand
haricotvert
Dec. 4th, 2009 06:52 am (UTC)
It's rather rude imho, but no foul here, since he did pay for it. Unless he's claiming it as his own. then he's got trouble.
yokofox
Dec. 4th, 2009 06:06 pm (UTC)
Far as I know, he's not claiming anything. He hasn't posted it yet, but that's because FA is still down, so...we'll see, I guess.
(no subject) - haricotvert - Dec. 5th, 2009 04:09 am (UTC) - Expand
thaily
Dec. 4th, 2009 06:53 am (UTC)
Disrespect aside, while he bought the original, and he can do what he wants to the original, he's not allowed to make a derivative product. Especially not if he's going to redistribute said product, like say, by uploading it anywhere.

When you commission someone, you pay for the labor, not the rights unless there's a special arrangement to buy the latter as well. I know I certainly never include editing rights.

I'm confused as to why he didn't just ask the original artist to change the sketch and tell him if he wanted different colours. What's the point of getting a commission if you're just going to redraw it again.
alohawolf
Dec. 4th, 2009 07:00 am (UTC)
there is a reason I commission everything as work-for-hire.
(no subject) - lurkerwisp - Dec. 5th, 2009 12:20 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - alohawolf - Dec. 5th, 2009 02:08 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - yokofox - Dec. 4th, 2009 06:10 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - thaily - Dec. 4th, 2009 08:38 pm (UTC) - Expand
oki_warwolf
Dec. 4th, 2009 07:09 am (UTC)
When I get a commission like for instance just a digitally inked drawing, then I might take it and color it, but redrawing parts and completely recoloring an already finished piece is dumb.

Why not just ask for things to be that way instead of taking the picture and doing them yourself? Or if he's so picky about it and then just draw the picture for himself.

He did buy it which pretty much means it's his to do whatever with but really that's pretty gay to buy a piece of art that you're just going to alter right after you get it.
digivolution
Dec. 4th, 2009 07:20 am (UTC)
Pretty much exactly what I think about the situation.
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neolucky
Dec. 4th, 2009 07:52 am (UTC)
This is something you could have discussed in person, imo. This didn't need to be brought up here as a smear campaign to one of your roomates. Frankly, he bought it, he can alter it as long as he isn't distributing/selling it. Telling everyone here to "OMG AVOID AVOID" is just overboard and ends up making you, the op, look bad.
mpd_84
Dec. 4th, 2009 08:18 am (UTC)
theres no real evidence eather.just their word...
(no subject) - bladespark - Dec. 4th, 2009 08:29 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - yokofox - Dec. 4th, 2009 06:19 pm (UTC) - Expand
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herraardy
Dec. 4th, 2009 08:47 am (UTC)
What changes did they make?

I've even helped edit someone else's commission before because their character changed over time and it was a small fix~ Unless they're doing something offensive to the image I wouldn't really think of it as being all that terrible.
monster_turtles
Dec. 4th, 2009 09:04 am (UTC)
I could be wrong, but if he was doing this in the privacy of his bedroom, with no intention of redistributing the edited picture to the Internet, you're pretty much infringing on his privacy since you're talking about what he's doing in his own space. In any case, you might want to discuss with your roomies, because somehow I don't think your living situation would be comfortable if Frisky found out you were deterring people from doing his commissions.

On a side note, you mentioned Crys worked solidly from sketch to full colour. In the future, she should consider sending 'progress' images. In fact, she doesn't even HAVE to, if you guys live together... she could show it to him directly, while she's working on it. That way he could give his input, and she could edit stuff as she's working on it.

I always send WIP images to the commissioner, and don't move forward with the image until the sketch has been approved, followed by the inked version. That way, when I've finished it, if they suddenly start complaining that they don't like the anatomy I can say, "You approved it yourself earlier, I have made no changes since." It avoids me having to do unnecessary edits once the picture is fully coloured and completed.
byakko_tsuki
Dec. 4th, 2009 01:36 pm (UTC)
I couldn't agree more.
(no subject) - yamato_iouko - Dec. 4th, 2009 02:45 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - yokofox - Dec. 4th, 2009 06:17 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - monster_turtles - Dec. 4th, 2009 11:35 pm (UTC) - Expand
mr_cullen
Dec. 4th, 2009 10:25 am (UTC)
I'm not going to get into the never ending argument what what is/isn't legal or whatever to do with commisions a person gets but seriously. Editing someone's work like that after paying them money seems like kind of a dick move and pretty much a waste of cash to boot. WHY SPEND THAT CASH IF YOU WEREN'T HAPPY WITH IT?!

FURRIES AUGH
morning_dragon
Dec. 4th, 2009 10:25 am (UTC)
Having had an artist who had an agreement with me in writing that they would not sell reprints of something I purchased, turn around and alter one color in the art and then sell mass prints I have very little sympathy for artists.

As a side note, you can alter a picture and upload it. Full pic or parts. What do you think half the icons you see people have here are? Just the face pic of a much larger picture. So if you can cut away 90 odd percent of a picture to do as you see fit, alter away.
bladespark
Dec. 4th, 2009 12:10 pm (UTC)
"Having had an artist who had an agreement with me in writing that they would not sell reprints of something I purchased, turn around and alter one color in the art and then sell mass prints I have very little sympathy for artists."

That seems a little harsh, to tar the entire community of artists because of the bad behavior of one single person.
(no subject) - yamato_iouko - Dec. 4th, 2009 02:50 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - ulariogryphon - Dec. 4th, 2009 03:56 pm (UTC) - Expand
growly
Dec. 4th, 2009 02:57 pm (UTC)
I really don't care what the commissioner does with the art after they've paid me.
If your roommate was bothered by this, she should have made her own post, you shouldn't have to speak for her. Maybe she doesn't care at all either.
spiffystuff
Dec. 4th, 2009 04:33 pm (UTC)
don't know about laws but
Politeness would dictate the commissioner should have checked with the artist BEFORE commissioning whether the artist would have been okay with this. If not, they should have passed on the commission.

At the same time, I fail to see why altering the work is such an upsetting thing, if they paid in full. So unless this person knew that some artists don't like this, I don't think it's entirely unreasonable that they wouldn't have thought to ask. (it is also quite possible that they knew and don't see anything wrong with it so just decided not to tell people, which isn't quite the right move IMHO)

I personally would have no problem with it as long as they credit me, and possibly link to the original if like, they're making the art look super craptastic XD

As to people asking why the guy's altering the work - they probably don't want to be one of "those people" who are asking artists to tweak a million different things. Or maybe they just enjoy playing around with art of their character. It doesn't seem that hard to understand :P
animehoneybee
Dec. 4th, 2009 07:14 pm (UTC)
Re: don't know about laws but
I agree. I suppose the difference here is how close the business relationship is. For example, I'd find it hard to believe someone who said they'd never drawn a mustache on pic in a magazine or newspaper they'd bought. to think of something blowing their top over something like that seems pretty far fetched.

I guess working with the artist one on one creates a more personal bond, you know the who its from and the who its going to, so I can see the artist being miffed. At the end of the day, drawing a mustache is pretty much the same thing, not cool, but nothing to spazz over.
Re: don't know about laws but - dutchtoast - Dec. 4th, 2009 10:23 pm (UTC) - Expand
anjel_kitty
Dec. 4th, 2009 04:58 pm (UTC)
Sigh gotta love it when furries take interpersonal conflict to the internet.
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