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Redux on Anuvia

After a month of waiting for Anuvia to clear her name, as she said she would the day after my first post here, I decided to make another to post to update.

Original post is here: http://community.livejournal.com/artists_beware/243254.html#cutid1

It's marked as resolved, because once she emailed me after I made that post, I thought, hey, maybe it's going to be fine now that we're in contact. Things didn't quite turn out that way. The night I posted on A_B originally, her screen name signed on MSN. The person on it claimed that he was her boyfriend, not her, then proceeded to berate me for a half hour, asking questions about the situation which the A_B post covered. I kept replying that, since he wasn't her, I couldn't comment on it, and that he should ask her for the answers or read the post.

An email to her from 5/12:

Hi hi, I was wondering since it's been a week, would you like me to mail you my old clunky digital camera I use? I mean, you can always mail it back? Actually, if you want to just mail me the book and talk about a partial refund, that's fine. What do you think? If the book was 100 drawings, and you did 30, would you be okay with sending back two thirds? So if 525 divided by thirds is 175, and I sent 300, you would send 125 back? However you want to do it. I'd prefer it if you would send the book and a check, after we've agreed upon the amount.

I didn't receive a reply, but after commenting and getting this response http://community.livejournal.com/artists_beware/243254.html?thread=6791478#t6791478 I didn't know what to think.

I gave it some more time, but I decided to take action now. I'm utterly sick of being ignored, told to wait, and assured that there will be photos soon, only to be told something happened or worse, told nothing. I suggest against commissioning Anuvia, Aphrodite, or the newly minted PudgeySabertooth on FA.

Also, I've been told by one of her commissioners who DID receive a refund that there were several other people still waiting for refunds. I would ask that anyone awaiting a refund from her come forward to comment, and, if you are in the state of California, feel free to email me at decadist@msn.com. She and I are both located in the same state. I've filled out small claims court papers (I figured a 30 dollar fee is worth getting everything settled) for Riverside county, the county where she is located, and I would like to add names to the plaintiff list.

EDIT: Anuvia is currently taking action to make things right, selling things to put together a refund, and intends to get proof of the book when able. Meanwhile, I've made promises to use phone calls in a polite manner rather than emails to keep in contact with her. I'm sure both of us can hardly keep track of all the comments, and for the large part the discussion has become a debate of policy. I thought this would be interesting to read, regardless of whose argument it serves: http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/edu/pubs/consumer/tech/tec07.shtm

I don't think I'll have any hard feelings towards her after this is all over, and when she has the book I will be obliged to pay her for the work that was done, regardless of how long it took to get photos.

Thanks!
- Aurelina/Dirge
Artist's beware has moved!
Do NOT repost your old bewares. They are being archived.
https://artistsbeware.info/

Comments

( 182 comments — Leave a comment )
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anuvia
Jun. 12th, 2009 03:23 am (UTC)
First of all, BLACKMAIL and Libel are criminal offenses, so be careful on what you post here. Also, this entry has been printed and filed for future reference.

Second of all, I'd informed you that I wouldn't be online much due to the fact I was out of town this past weekend and a considerable amount of my time prior would be spent in school/job hunting and dealing with my mother's tumor (to which you compared to your own "family problems" which, I'm sorry, hardly amount to your father and brother not keeping the house clean.)

Also, I'd like to add that you have EVERY means by which you can contact me including my phone number. I've told you time and time again you're free to call, and when you can't reach me online, why on earth didn't you call the phone? I'd of been happy to talk to you.

In addition, go ahead and make the threats to sue me. On a legal standpoint, you have no case as I'd only received 1/3 of the total payment and I am under no obligation to deliver the product until it is paid for in full. The original auction and final bid are also printed and in a file along with the furbid Terms of Service and bidder agreements. I can actually press charges since you are guilty of libel, blackmail and if your suit does go through, frivolous lawsuit- all of which are illegal. OH and I could also go for another claim on "disclosing Private information" since you took it upon yourself to publicly announce the county in which I live.

As for the sketchbook itself, at the demands of both you and other folks in the community, it was left in the custody of a friend by the name of Darren Bingham who offered to scan the book for me. Darren, was called out to Florida (central florida to be exact) to tend to his dying grandmother and I've since been unable to reacquisition the sketchbook. And, no offense but I'm not going to call and harass a man when he's watching his Grandmother die. You were also informed of this information.

Regardless of this, I've been MORE than accommodating with this situation and I have offered refunds TEN times at this juncture and I have the emails to prove it. You REFUSED refunds time after time after having been informed that it would take a long time to complete and I did not have a camera.

I've also been very reasonable and kind about the situation considering the auction in question turned out to be some petty battle with Dax. After putting the bids upto $975 for the sake of exacting some grudge, Most of the folks who went in on the bid attempted to back out where as the second highest bidder would have paid me the entire amount and would have done so up front. Your bullshit reasoning behind it was "Oh, he sucks to get commissions from because he's so picky" only to have you write out, page for page, what will be on EVERY inch of that sketchbook. I was still very kind to you about the situation.

Regardless, I'm quite honestly tired of trying to work with you over the situation. I'm doing what I said I was going to do prior, and I'm selling off my personal possessions to refund you the price of the sketch book, AND in addition to that, once it is in my possession I will acquire scans/photos and will use them to clear my name. Promptly after, the book will be kept for evidence.


I'd also like to add that your false claims about outstanding commissions from me are hilariously pathetic. I not only completed all of the commissions, but MOST OF THEM WERE COMPLETED IN OPENCANVAS WITH YOU PRESENT. The event files are all readily available if need be presented.
(Deleted comment)
(no subject) - anuvia - Jun. 12th, 2009 03:47 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - dirge_de_valeur - Jun. 12th, 2009 03:50 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - anuvia - Jun. 12th, 2009 03:51 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - dirge_de_valeur - Jun. 12th, 2009 03:58 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - melloyellowduck - Jun. 12th, 2009 03:42 am (UTC) - Expand
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(no subject) - dirge_de_valeur - Jun. 12th, 2009 03:56 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - anuvia - Jun. 12th, 2009 04:02 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - dirge_de_valeur - Jun. 12th, 2009 04:10 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - anuvia - Jun. 12th, 2009 04:23 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - dirge_de_valeur - Jun. 12th, 2009 04:56 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - dirge_de_valeur - Jun. 12th, 2009 05:34 am (UTC) - Expand
THIRD PERSON SPEAKING! - oceandezignz - Jun. 12th, 2009 06:55 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: THIRD PERSON SPEAKING! - dirge_de_valeur - Jun. 12th, 2009 07:05 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: THIRD PERSON SPEAKING! - oceandezignz - Jun. 12th, 2009 07:11 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: THIRD PERSON SPEAKING! - dirge_de_valeur - Jun. 12th, 2009 07:15 am (UTC) - Expand
FOURTH PERSON SPEAKING! - thaily - Jun. 12th, 2009 08:32 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: FOURTH PERSON SPEAKING! - dirge_de_valeur - Jun. 12th, 2009 08:38 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: FOURTH PERSON SPEAKING! - anuvia - Jun. 12th, 2009 09:01 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: FOURTH PERSON SPEAKING! - dirge_de_valeur - Jun. 12th, 2009 09:03 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: FOURTH PERSON SPEAKING! - dirge_de_valeur - Jun. 23rd, 2009 08:51 pm (UTC) - Expand
(Screened comment)
Re: FOURTH PERSON SPEAKING! - dirge_de_valeur - Jun. 23rd, 2009 09:45 pm (UTC) - Expand
Re: FOURTH PERSON SPEAKING! - anuvia - Jun. 23rd, 2009 09:47 pm (UTC) - Expand
Re: FOURTH PERSON SPEAKING! - dirge_de_valeur - Jul. 17th, 2009 06:06 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: FOURTH PERSON SPEAKING! - kerstin_orion - Jun. 24th, 2009 02:34 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - lilenth - Jun. 12th, 2009 11:05 pm (UTC) - Expand
oceandezignz
Jun. 12th, 2009 04:20 am (UTC)
... wow. Ummm... wow. This is a shitstorm if I ever saw one. I'm completely impressed with this! In thinking you'd get your way like Burger King, you ended up being denied and about to get a pie in the eye I'd say!

If this was that important to you, you'd have been more understanding and waited. Or, you would have taken the refund when it was offered and not resorted to trying to use A_B like it was some sort of CHANBOARD!

Good luck, you're gonna need it.
anuvia
Jun. 12th, 2009 04:26 am (UTC)
this.
whitewashsunset
Jun. 12th, 2009 04:54 am (UTC)
Good on you for taking her to court. From the way she reacted to this, it's pretty obvious that they only way to solve the issue is to have an outside party come in, since she refuses to work with you. I'm just sorry you had to go through all of this to begin with.

Hopefully a lesson was learned on the artist's part that if you don't like it, don't agree to it. There's being nice, and then there's being dumb. And, well... we can see what happened here.
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oceandezignz
Jun. 12th, 2009 05:00 am (UTC)
THIS!
bladespark
Jun. 12th, 2009 05:17 am (UTC)
I spy another case of "would never work with either of these people" here. I don't think either side smells like roses at this junction.
lurkerwisp
Jun. 12th, 2009 07:03 am (UTC)
agreed. :|
(no subject) - pomander - Jun. 12th, 2009 08:23 am (UTC) - Expand
alcyione
Jun. 12th, 2009 08:06 am (UTC)
YER BOTH WRONG. STOP QUARRELING, THE PLAN IS SIMPLE. Artist; refund money. Commissioner; Accept money. Both of you keep quiet and keep off of the lawn, dang kids.

*edit to remove swears, bad genet*


Edited at 2009-06-12 08:08 am (UTC)
anuvia
Jun. 12th, 2009 09:11 am (UTC)
Funny enough, that's what I've been offering to do for quite some time now XD
(no subject) - alcyione - Jun. 12th, 2009 09:14 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - anuvia - Jun. 12th, 2009 09:40 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - anuvia - Jun. 12th, 2009 09:41 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - alcyione - Jun. 12th, 2009 11:07 am (UTC) - Expand
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atomicstoney
Jun. 12th, 2009 08:21 am (UTC)
Okay. Let me get this straight.


So, A, you're pissed that you're not getting a commission that you've only paid a third of the way for, and B, are willing to take someone to court over it, despite the fact that the commissioner has offered you a refund several times, all of which you've adamantly refused.

I can't help but think of that famous line from the movie Cool Hand Luke: What we got here... is a failure to communicate.

First of all, the idea of taking someone to court over a sketchbook full of furry porn is just downright laughable to me, if only for the fact that the travel costs, legal fees, etc. would end up costing you MORE than the amount that you would win, under the highly unlikely circumstance of you actually winning.

Second, if you're unhappy with how a commissioner is doing business, and they're actually considerate enough to offer you a refund...? Fucking take it. From what I'm reading, Anu is is being more than a good enough sport about all of these, up to and including selling her possessions in order to refund your money, even though you weren't even responsible enough to pay the full amount that YOU owed. Never mind that your friends dropped out of payment; if it's YOUR name on the highest bid, then it's YOUR responsibility.

And the fact that you and your friends only bid on the auction to oust another person out of winning proves that you are not only irresponsible, but also petty as all-fuck.

As for everyone else who finds it necessary to bring up "overdue commissions" as some sort of incriminating debate point, that's irrelevant. Any sort of grievances that customers have with their commissioners need to be taken up privately, and not aired out in public forums in a ridiculous display of passive-aggressive faggotry. If it's none of your business, butt the hell out.
pomander
Jun. 12th, 2009 08:25 am (UTC)
I think you're missing the part where the artist has failed to deliver any proof that they've worked on the art. The commissioner would be a fool to pay the other 2/3 (hundreds of dollars!) when they can't even manage after a year to take a picture or scan a single thing when they've shown photographs of their tattoo work and posted other stuff in the meanwhile.
(no subject) - atomicstoney - Jun. 12th, 2009 08:42 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - pomander - Jun. 12th, 2009 09:26 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - atomicstoney - Jun. 12th, 2009 07:10 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - pomander - Jun. 12th, 2009 07:24 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - anuvia - Jun. 12th, 2009 09:28 pm (UTC) - Expand
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(no subject) - anuvia - Jun. 12th, 2009 09:29 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - pomander - Jun. 12th, 2009 07:12 pm (UTC) - Expand
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(no subject) - dirge_de_valeur - Jun. 12th, 2009 09:34 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - anuvia - Jun. 12th, 2009 09:48 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - dirge_de_valeur - Jun. 12th, 2009 10:04 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - anuvia - Jun. 12th, 2009 10:39 pm (UTC) - Expand
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thaily
Jun. 12th, 2009 08:39 am (UTC)
I would advise both parties to keep their correspondence in a written form so you have some proof of what was actually said if this does end up in court. That said, with all due respect, preferably not in this community. Just let us know what the end result is and save us the he-said-she-said drama spam. I don't think there's anything more the people in this community can do for you, and at least in private correspondence you can cut all of Anuvia's foulmouthed friends from the discussion.
anuvia
Jun. 12th, 2009 10:00 am (UTC)
My foulmouthed friends? Who are we talking about, exactly?
(no subject) - thaily - Jun. 12th, 2009 11:34 am (UTC) - Expand
kudzinowski
Jun. 12th, 2009 08:47 am (UTC)
what a complete headache. on both sides.
otherotter
Jun. 12th, 2009 09:05 am (UTC)
Anuvia - If you have done work, you are entitled to keep payment for whatever work you have done. If you have indeed done 1/3rd of the work, then you need to clip those pages out of the book and send them to this Dirge person.

If you have done work, you deserve to be paid for it.

If this happens, Dirge gets art, you get to keep your personal belongings and no longer have to worry about the rest of the sketchbook.
anuvia
Jun. 12th, 2009 09:34 am (UTC)
Unfortunately, the sketchbook in question isn't within my reach and I have no idea when it will be again. I do believe I am entitled to some compensation for the amount of work I have done (Which can easily be over 200 total hours - 32 completely sketched, inked and pencil colored pages in addition to 8 pages of sketches and inks easily add up to that) but I'd honestly bite the cost of the labor I'd invested in the work to just end the needless smearing of my good name. I still intend on posting the work when I do get the book back if only to prove I'm not some conartist, but I'd rather just end this now.

As for selling my personal belongings, it's already started XD
-> http://community.livejournal.com/pkmncollectors/3033076.html

Selling the only stuff I actually don't need on that link. Granted that collection took me years to build up, it's only silly pokemon stuff.
(no subject) - dirge_de_valeur - Jun. 12th, 2009 09:40 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - anuvia - Jun. 12th, 2009 09:49 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - mukichan - Jun. 12th, 2009 02:21 pm (UTC) - Expand
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(no subject) - atomicstoney - Jun. 12th, 2009 06:58 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - keaalu - Jun. 12th, 2009 07:51 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - anuvia - Jun. 12th, 2009 09:08 pm (UTC) - Expand
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anuvia
Jun. 12th, 2009 09:58 am (UTC)
Just making a note here that it's 3am and I'm tired of camping this journal. I'm going to sleep for now.
warsawkook
Jun. 12th, 2009 11:11 am (UTC)
To clear a few things up:

CALIFORNIA PENAL CODE, SECTIONS 518-519
"Extortion is the obtaining of property from another, with his consent, or the obtaining of an official act of a public officer, induced by a wrongful use of force or fear, or under color of official right." (§ 518).

"Fear, such as will constitute extortion, may be induced by a threat, either:
1. To do an unlawful injury to the person or property of the individual threatened or of a third person; or,
2. To accuse the individual threatened, or any relative of his, or member of his family, of any crime; or,
3. To expose, or to impute to him or them any deformity, disgrace or crime; or,
4. To expose any secret affecting him or them." (§ 519).


According to a CA lawyer's site,
Blackmail is extortion by threatening another person's reputation or organization with the disclosure of harmful or secret information that would be damaging to that person if released.

Now if you want to read that literally, go right ahead and call all of A_B extortion.

HOWEVER the COURTS tend to use this thing called the "Reasonable Person's Standard" (you can read up on that here), and within that it's safe to say that the "Reasonable Person" would look at this post alone and say "There is no Blackmail or Extortion occurring here" as this appears to be much like a customer review of a website, product, company, or anything else along those lines.

Next, you'd be pretty surprised to find out exactly HOW MUCH of anyone's "personal" information is actually public. Revealing the current county of residence is by no means disclosing personal information; in fact it's the most common piece of information attached to someone's name. (For the most part - your name, county of residence, address/phone number, and household income are considered public information and are easily obtained UNLESS you specifically request certain items be removed from public record, usually in the case of law enforcement or governmental issues/officials.)

Now my own opinion on the situation at hand:
Commissioner - keep records, and contact the artist directly by telephone if need be. DO NOT HARASS THE ARTIST. One, MAYBE two calls a week (again, "Reasonable Person Standard".) Your frustration is understandable but remember that they ARE human, and that humans don't react well to excess stressors; be patient, don't hound them. Work out a refund plan with exact amounts and exact dates and hold them to that (make sure it's in writing as well.) If that fails, then proceed with whatever actions you've been advised are the next step.

Artist - keep records, and keep in contact. IMO your wireless crapping out is a poor excuse; write an EMail offline and use the two seconds you have a connection to send it, or even take twenty minutes out to use a computer at a library. IF everyone else on this auction has backed out, then either do the work only for this particular commissioner and send it on its way, or give this particular commissioner their part of the money back and be done with it.

Neither of you need to deal with this past the finish of the business transaction; understandably art takes a long time to produce, but if it's not going to work out then the only other viable solution is a refund. Commissioner is fed up, artist is aggravated, an aggravated artist doesn't produce their best quality work - again IMO, everyone would be happier with the refund solution.

Now excuse me, it's too friggin early to be sticking my snout in someone else's business and I ain't had my coffee yet.

Good luck you two.
feathery
Jun. 12th, 2009 01:13 pm (UTC)
I honestly have to agree with this. I don't think a month is an unreasonable amount of time to get proof the work is being done. I would think even a cell phone camera picture would suffice as proof.

Artist, giving your work to a friend to scan is HIGHLY unprofessional. If you do not own your own scanner, you could have easily taken this to Kinkos, Staples, or a similar place to be scanned. If you are concerned with the subject matter, then you should have taken $100 of this auction's proceeds and purchased yourself a scanner. Yes, they are that cheap and yes, I have done this twice when my current scanner crapped out, both times whileworking a minimum wage job that gave barely 20 hours a week.

I don't care if you friend has a dying grandmother, you are the one that needs to come through here and produce some proof that work is being done, if you're so concerned with your reputation. He may even welcome the distraction (I would have when my grandfather died). So "harass" this friend for this book, get it back in your hands, and get some kind of images of the work inside.

I would also take a lesson from this to never rely on friends to do what you are responsible for. Unless you are paying them, then that is not their job.
(no subject) - whitewashsunset - Jun. 12th, 2009 03:22 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - eonii - Jun. 12th, 2009 05:44 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - feathery - Jun. 12th, 2009 05:55 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - anuvia - Jun. 12th, 2009 10:48 pm (UTC) - Expand
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tizzrah
Jun. 12th, 2009 03:24 pm (UTC)
I'm always amazed at how things like this go down, considering if any of this happened in the "real world," (i.e. outside of any fandom), Anuvia should have been taken to court long ago.

The bottom line is this. A purchase was made. Money exchanged hands. The product was not delivered. In the business world, that's the only thing that matters. Not, "well Dirge should just accept the refund!" or "I don't have a camera to prove the work was done!" None of that matters. Business is business is business. If you go to a sign-making company, and commission a sign, and pay a deposit, that business has to make your sign, and consequently show you progress of the sign being made. They made not have to give you the sign until you've paid in full, but you are entitled to see that it's being worked on before you pay any more money.

This is the reason that I don't commission artists anymore unless they are professional and have a licensed business. This kind of thing is absolutely childish and ridiculous.
rakz
Jun. 12th, 2009 05:44 pm (UTC)
No, the money wasn't delivered. One third of the price was delivered.

Total agreed price:...........$900 dollars

Delivered amount:.............$300 dollars

Anuvia is under no contractual obligation to complete or even begin production until the agreed price is delivered in full. Its out of the goodness of her heart and trust in those apparently not worthy of it that she began at all.

I've noticed most of the people who are on the side of Dirge de Valeur in this argument either have not fully read and understood the argument, or are just firing from the hip completely based off their own thoughts. What Dirge paid was not a deposit. There was no agreed upon deposit system made here. There was no system of payment exchange based on how far along the project was towards completion. You cannot somehow infer how this exchange should have proceeded based upon a contract of an entirely different provider. Your argument is completely invalid.
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eonii
Jun. 12th, 2009 06:00 pm (UTC)
Well um, I thought it was pretty ridiculous when the artist wasn't emailing finished, digital files to commissioners (hence all the assholish remarks in that last entry, heh), but she's taken care of that, it's over with, and I'm just gonna second everyone and say you should just be strong and take the refund she's offering.

I definitely think the artist should have used the library or kinko's before this turned into a huge mess instead of relying on someone else, but she's offering a refund and at this point I don't understand why this has not just ended ?_? you have her number, I don't know why you aren't using it
atomicstoney
Jun. 12th, 2009 06:54 pm (UTC)
Because the OP is comfortable with whining at everyone else instead of dealing with the problem up front.
(no subject) - pomander - Jun. 12th, 2009 07:46 pm (UTC) - Expand
minimalismo
Jun. 12th, 2009 10:31 pm (UTC)
1) Always sign a contract with the artist (in person if possible),
2) Keep commissions simple (none of this "10 people paid for 1 sketchbook" or whatever ladder thing)
3) Artists asking for a deposit must complete artwork before full payment is made. Some artists ask for full payment up front (usually businesses do this).

Wow... since joining artists_beware, I can not believe the amount of artists & commissioners who are just so flaky about doing business. I'm not calling anyone here flaky, but it all seems so confusing (to both parties involved)!

If someone commissions me, there is a no-fee consultation right up front. If I can't do the project, and if the client does not see something they like on my walls, I will find the best possible artist to complete their project and let it go.

I usually try and get a feel for what the person is like before agreeing to the project. If they are high-maintenance and demanding, I will tell them that I am not the right artist for their project. Can't deal with annoying people at all.
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