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Uhh help...

Hi, sorry I know this probably isnt even going to make sense

maybe it's because this piece is so precious to me.

...its here:

the guy who won is is from http://www.galleryculture.com .

(he does approval of submissions i think~)

he was interest in a few other of my arts, and I end up selling to him one other one as well...

i became a bit timid during the whole emailing process because.. well...
little things... i'm really protective of this art , and my story.

i don't want to be took advantage of... i dont know how i'm describing this situation...
he ask me how much the non-auction piece will be without the frame... but i always like to included a frame with my art, because that's just how i'm secure about it...
i gave in and told him, since i usually dont charge an extra for frames, that i will just ship that art for free.


anyway, i send him my invoice through ebay once the Prince auction end,
but then he email me and asks me, to resend an invoice including the cost of the other art he bought from me.

okay.. no problem... but

he also want that one unframed.
i almost started to cry. i feel so insecure, even if i do send it with the frame now,
i am still so scared.
i don't know what intention he has with my art, not wanting the frames.
my only intention of giving this art out is to be able to share it with someone else, to enjoy it, hence why i always include frames...

the time i spent on the ebay art... it is soo soo close to my heart! and to think i'd be sending it to a place where its open and unprotected, vulnerable, it makes me so sad all the things going through my head...

and besides that, again, i don't know what his intentions are.

during our emails before, he asked me if i ever heard of printmaking, and was suggesting different kinds of printing my art would look nice in.... i replied to him, no, but i should research it...

he never mentioned that again. but he seem really after my art.

well... some would say, if i'm so insecure, to just not take his money.

it was an ebay auction, and it would be very difficult to change my mind after its end... and again, i could just be freaking out over nothing... but..

deep inside i feel really insecure about it.

Also, he asked me if i would have interest in illustrating a book for him... I said yea, asked more info..
but then he said he want to see my art in person first before he's positive.

...anyway, name is Leo Madrid, if anyone has heard anyof him, or galleryculture.com,

please please please let me know...

also, any word of comfort, i would appreciate so much :.(

thanks so much...

Love Always,
Artist's beware has moved!
Do NOT repost your old bewares. They are being archived.


( 16 comments — Leave a comment )
Aug. 16th, 2004 03:40 pm (UTC)
I'm not sure if I'm interpreting this correctly, but It doesn't quite sound like he's out to take advantage of you. Maybe he's just a fan, and he has plans to put your work in a different mat or frame.. Sometimes people buy art for a frame they already have (I do, at least) so why get a frame you might not need if you have plans to put it in another?
Try asking him some questions, like what plans he has for it, if he plans to reframe it, etcetera. Don't be afraid to firmly state "I only sell my art with frames, it makes me feel more confident about selling it, my only intention of giving this art out is to be able to share it with someone else, to enjoy it, and if I sell it in a frame it helps insure that others will see and enjoy it."
Then maybe say if they want it shipped frameless, you want to be sure its framed?

I'm not sure if this helped.. but don't be shy to tell people what you want, and what you're willing to do with your art. Its ok to accomidate people sometimes, but don't let them walk all over you.
Aug. 16th, 2004 04:21 pm (UTC)
thanks a whole lot
thanks very much, it was really reassuring to read your reply

i think i will ask...
i mean... im REALLY shy, you noted :.(
im always so affraid to ask stuff like that, like it may offend someone...

but you are truly right, i...
think i do have the right to know, or at least to ask.

thanks a bunch :.) it relly meant a lot!

Love Always,
Aug. 16th, 2004 04:00 pm (UTC)
I think you should put your foot down and tell him that you don't ship out art without the frames. If he wants the frames off of it, then he can remove them himself. You also need to find out what he intends to do with your artwork. Be firm. If you're not, you won't get the answers you're looking for.
Aug. 16th, 2004 04:25 pm (UTC)
Yes, that's exactly how i saw it...
i wondered if he's just trying to save money, but honestly, i do not charge extra for the frame. it only adds up in shipment, but the amount he relieves the shipment of is probably not as much as it wold cost him to buy the frame himself... which really had me so confused~

You are 100% right though. I do need to be firm and ask my questions...
he's probably older than me, and i'd hate to seem rude in anysense.
but you are very right!

thanks a whole lot for this, it helped a bunch!

Love Always,
Aug. 16th, 2004 04:51 pm (UTC)
Glad I could help out.
Aug. 16th, 2004 04:11 pm (UTC)
In the future, if you're so uncomfortable selling your artwork, then you shouldn't sell it.

In the meantime, tell the customer that you prefer to ship with the frames to avoid damage, and he can always remove them later himself.

But really, if you get so upset over this, just don't sell your art over EBay any more.
Aug. 16th, 2004 04:32 pm (UTC)
oh no
personally I cannot be happy if I can't share it with someone else~ it sounds weird but it's just how i stay sane.. it's kindof relaxing in itself to enjoy creating it so much, and to have another person enjoy having it, and really having a connection to what ever feeling you put into the piece~

I'm pretty comfortable to sell it :.) just this time, it was a work I feel a EXTREMELY close to, and to have such an odd request of it, i guess makes me feel more protective and inquisitive of wether the person truly enjoys and wants it for only that reason, or if they had other intentions with it...

thanks a bunch for this. i think i will talk to him about the frames part as well :.)

again really, thankyou :.)

Love ALways,

Aug. 16th, 2004 04:52 pm (UTC)
Re: oh no
Personally, if I bought an original I would not want it shipped in a frame. Why? Well, frames being shipped have a habit of breaking and shards of glass will likely tear the artwork. Plus many art collectors don't actually hang all of their art some keep it in a presentation book.

Also, if the seller had to know why I didn't want the frames I would get a little annoyed, after all, why do they need to know what I'm going to do with something I purchased as long as I'm not violating copyright? To me it would seem very pushy.

Just my opinion but I woudn't worry about it, there's many practical reasons why someone might not want the included frames and none are nefarious
Aug. 16th, 2004 05:13 pm (UTC)
Re: oh no
Sorry if that came off harsh btw but I'm very big on artists who sell their work erring on the side of pleasing the person putting money in their bank accounts. The man may well collect a bunch of art and have no wall space but likes to keep a presentation book of originals to show off, many people do. He might also prefer the person who framed it be the one to remove it since it makes it less likely that it will be damaged in the process.

If you're really worried about copyright infringement be sure to include a standard copyright notice of some sort in with the work. something along the lines of a card with what rights the buyer does and does not aquire, that way there is zero ambiguity.
Aug. 16th, 2004 05:51 pm (UTC)
I think you ought to learn to have a certain detachment to your art if you are going to sell it. Keep a high quality print, or just keep a jpg on your computer to remember it. They aren't your children, they are images on paper. I love my art too but once it's sold frankly I don't care if they take it home and use it as toilet paper. The image is still my own, that's just the piece of paper it's on, whether it's digital or traditional media.

Hell, if he pays you and doesn't intend to infringe on your copyrights by selling prints, then don't worry about it.

I would never want art shipped in a frame, it costs so much more to ship and it could break. I'd rather pick out my own frame.

And really, there is a law out there that "protects" artists work, but if he wanted to take your work and jerk off to it or something there is nothing you can really do if you think about it. Either accept the fact that you are no longer in control of your work once it's sold, or don't sell it.

Personally if I made a painting and managed to sell it for $200, and the guy paid, I wouldn't have any complaints. Congratulations by the way!

Don't be shy ;-D and I apologize if I am coming off as blunt, but business is business.
Aug. 16th, 2004 06:05 pm (UTC)
hey :.)
Thanks a whole lot! :.)

I'm relly totally okay with send art away, I actually use to send originals without make a copy for myself, up until last mont or so~ when I decide I want to have some art here as well :.)

just awkward requests by buyers, this is the first time I got one that made me somewhat uncomfortable :.(

Thanks so much for noting the law~ I heard this before, and which is why i was so okay with not ever making copies, just sending authentification card and what not.

I guess i just worried about this one so much because it also come with a (part of)story, and i'm not sure if i can also cover my story by my natural copyright that the art gets :.{

And really thanks for that :.))
Don't apologize, your reply really helped :.)
Thankyou for being so clear as well~~

Have a great day :.)

Love Always,
Aug. 16th, 2004 06:21 pm (UTC)
Keep a high res scan, and maybe even a photo of yourself with the original, in case there are ever any problems!

There is nothing wrong with asking the winner, point blank - "Are you keeping this for yourself or are you planning to re-sell it?"

In all of my auctions (I sell on eBay using the ID strangeling ) I say:

"Copyright © by Jasmine Becket-Griffith
All rights reserved by artist. Buyer is not purchasing the rights to the image. Any and all publishing and reproduction rights are reserved solely by the artist. This image is not to be re-distributed, copied, imitated, or misappropriated in any way. If you are in any way unsure of the legal rights retained by the artist following the sale of the work, or are purchasing this artwork with the intention of re-selling this work you must be aware of the Visual Artists Rights Act. Thank you!"

And where it says "Visual Artists Rights Act" I link to this: http://www.artslaw.org/MORAL.HTM

That way it is clear to the bidders that they are just buying the painting, not the right to publish, reproduce, exhibit, etc. the painting. In your future auctions you might want to put something like that in there!
Aug. 18th, 2004 12:51 am (UTC)
Jasmine thanks! :.D

I looked into all your suggestions (you art is so cute you know!)

And I relized I was actually leaving out a lot of stuff in copyright... :.{
Thanks a WHOLE lot! the latest auction, I did it differently, my paranoia took over so probably there is about over 5 different copyright taggings on the screen!

Thanks a MILLION bunch! :.D
it really meant and helped a lot~

feeling a lot more confident now :.)

Love Always,
Aug. 18th, 2004 11:40 am (UTC)
Re: hi!
Thank you, Pee!!! >^__^<

Lol, I thought your name sounded familiar - I looked it up on eBay and I saw that looong ago I bought a Super Dollfie dress from you (under my bidding ID jasminetoad )! It is a small world!
Aug. 18th, 2004 12:41 am (UTC)
Sometimes you've got to let your baby go...
I know how it is to put days or months or years into a piece, and wanting the best out of the whole situation.
Here's my perspective on it:
1. If you can't bear to let your baby go, keep it as a portfolio piece. I've got a few pieces in my portfolio that I don't want to sell off, so I just keep them.
2. A few days or months after I make a piece of artwork, I think it's worth a million dollars. Put it in a drawer for a year, make new art, and I'd be willing to sell it for a dollar. My talent gets better, my tastes refine, and I don't get so upset about the art being destroyed or undervalued.
3. Normally customers are okay with paying shipping costs, just as long as you make the cost a footnote and not the amount on the bidding board. I wonder about how much those frames are costing you. I guess it doesn't matter if they pay you top dollar, but I, being cheap, like to ask for extra about that.
4. In my perspective, frames and boards are a hassle. I'm happy to cut shipping costs and not bother with them if possible.
Dec. 31st, 2004 04:00 pm (UTC)
omg, I feel so horrible for you... that guy doesn't deserve your artwork - I took a look at some of your stuff, and might I say you're very talented. I understand completely how you must be so protective of your artwork... if I were you I wouldn't sell to this guy again if that's possible :( <3 <3 <3
( 16 comments — Leave a comment )


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