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Noblewolf

Would like to know why my message about noblewolf is being rejected? That's pretty much it. I think other people should be warned as most people that get his suits don't fit and either need to be sent back to him (which wastes time) or to have someone else fix it (which in his little mind violates his toc)

So i'd like to know why? If you want to see a full account of what happened.. well here you go.

I gave Noblewolf a laptop (ibook) and a ipod (2gb nano) in exchange for two suits. When my mate got his suit.. neither the head or the body suit fit. I got my suit a few weeks later and the same dilema came up. I took both suits to blackfire seeing as we were at Further Confusion and we would like to wear them.. at this con?

He fixed them and I guess that pissed noblewolf off as no one likes to be told that their work is not perfect.

Now a small hole has developed in the underlayer of the suit.. and you know what? I'll pay for someone else to fix that too.. I don't care. I approached him first basically asking if anything would be done and he said that the suit was past 1 year old.

Um.. other fursuit builders.. like blackfire.. give a 1 year warranty with the unit. What.. your warranty is a few months and after that i'm screwed?

Fine. Go ahead. But the thing that makes me the angriest about this.. is that he bascially implied I have had fursuit sex in this suit.

I have said it before and i'll say it again. My suit is not built for that. period. And if he wants to go ahead and market suits for that.. more power to him. I have worn my suit 3 occassions, FC2006, halloween last year and FC2007. To have ANY type of damage in the suit with non strenous activity implies one thing.

Shoddy workmanship.

That's all i have to say about this matter.. other than there are other fursuit builders out there that'll stand by their work. I am sorry to say that noble is not one of them

Johnny
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Comments

( 45 comments — Leave a comment )
drake_anaya
Jan. 26th, 2007 08:04 pm (UTC)
Thanks for adding the details, I forgot to mention that's why I rejected your other post. Sorry about that :)
johnnyblanco
Jan. 26th, 2007 11:10 pm (UTC)
NP.. i can see why the first one was rejected.
khirmoonclaw
Jan. 26th, 2007 08:19 pm (UTC)
Sorry you had to deal with him Johhny.. I also had a bad experience with him and my first suit.

When it arrived it was about 3 times larger then myself and had so much unsculpted foam it looked like a giant furry brick. After expensing the suit back to him From Georiga to canada which wasnt cheap. He "remade the suit and it was the same mess just with less foam.. He then remade the entire suit and this time it fit much better and I was somewhat happy with it this time around and pretty much the first time I wore it seems started breaking and it did not last a con weekend.

He has improved greatly in his style but sadly he was short and childish with me as well in the end.
johnnyblanco
Jan. 26th, 2007 11:11 pm (UTC)
i think i remember that whole crap.. and believe me I feel for you.. what burns at my ass is that I DEFENDED him thru shit like that.. and he's like oh well you can get someone else to fix that
growly
Jan. 26th, 2007 08:45 pm (UTC)
A few questions for you.
When you and your mate first got your suits, did you tell Noble they didn't fit and ask him to fix it?
Mistakes happen, and sizing issues are usually very easy to fix.

Also, all suits need regular maintenance, especially if you are wearing it often. You only wore it to 3 cons, yes, but what you do in the suit during that time and how many hours will affect how it wears.

And comparing his warranty plan with Blackfire's is irrelevant. If you want Blackfire's warranty, buy a Blackfire suit. Everybody has their own terms and conditions, and if these terms were clearly laid out at the beginning of the commission, you have no right to complain.
johnnyblanco
Jan. 26th, 2007 11:13 pm (UTC)
How were we going to get him to fix it? The agreement is that these suits were to be delivered before FC and that they FIT. They DID NOT fit. At that point he violated the agreement so I went and enlisted Blackfire's help and he graciously took time and effort to fix two heads and two suits.. thursday.. lasting into the night so the suits were ready to go friday.
(no subject) - neolucky - Jan. 26th, 2007 11:30 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - johnnyblanco - Jan. 26th, 2007 11:49 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - crssafox - Jan. 27th, 2007 12:10 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - johnnyblanco - Jan. 27th, 2007 12:14 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - wereblood - Jan. 27th, 2007 01:28 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - johnnyblanco - Jan. 27th, 2007 02:04 am (UTC) - Expand
tabbicus
Jan. 26th, 2007 09:05 pm (UTC)
My mate and I just got fursuit boxers from him... no problems yet...
johnnyblanco
Jan. 26th, 2007 11:18 pm (UTC)
just make sure they don't break or have a hole in them.. good luck trying to get 'em fixed
joecifur
Jan. 26th, 2007 09:19 pm (UTC)
I've heard a fair share of bad press about *both* of those people, actually, but in all fairness--

Fursuiters can make mistakes or miscalculations just like artists. Did you contact Noble to let him know the suits didn't fit to give him a chance to fix them before you handed them to someone else? Sometimes corrections DO need to be made, and while I understand if you were in a rush and wanted to wear them right then, and the mistakes -are- his fault, if so you were the one who made the choice not to wait and made the choice to go to someone else.

Honestly, I don't know if I would feel 100% confident about doing free repairs if some third party'd worked on it. I'd definitely -try-, but I have no way of knowing how experienced the person that repaired it is or how different their way of working is from mine, or if -they- dicked something up by accident in the process.

Are you saying he refused to do anything at -all- after a year, or just refused to do anything for free? I mean -- a "small hole in the underlayer" hardly sounds like that big a deal to me. After three cons of goofing around and a year, I've had to do maintenance like that on several of my heads and suits, and I don't think that "implies one thing" at all. If it was me, I'd probably still fix it, sure, but if he wants to say it's over a year old that's -- his rules.

This sounds more like bad blood, bad communication and two people that just don't get along than something that shitty.. Otherwise, you need to be a little more descriptive of exactly what happened?
johnnyblanco
Jan. 26th, 2007 11:17 pm (UTC)
Again, as stated above. The agreement was to get these suits and for them to FIT at Further Confusion. We got them days before (I got savannah the night before the con). So that's that.

He refused to do any repairs at all.. saying if it was over a few months he'd fix it for free.. but then again I would have offered to pay for it and now I don't have to. I have suiters in the area that are more than willing to help now.

Basically I have heard horror stories from other furs about him as well adn you know what? I am done. There are other fursuit builders out there and i'd rather deal with someone that's going to be a bit more rational in their responses than someone that just says "No, you're out of luck."

And something else.. i noticed my fursuit fur is thinner than my mate's suit.. which has thicker fur. coincidence? I kinda doubt it.

Johnny
thaily
Jan. 26th, 2007 09:46 pm (UTC)
Hrmm, Blackfire, is he a chubby Canadian dude?
johnnyblanco
Jan. 26th, 2007 11:18 pm (UTC)
Think so. he so rocks! He fixed two suits and other suits all thursday of last years FC 2006.. god that was awesome. ;)
(no subject) - thaily - Jan. 27th, 2007 12:05 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - johnnyblanco - Jan. 27th, 2007 12:15 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - thaily - Jan. 27th, 2007 12:31 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - rs_studios - Jan. 27th, 2007 08:33 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: Just for future reference, - thaily - Jan. 27th, 2007 08:39 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: Just for future reference, - rs_studios - Jan. 27th, 2007 08:50 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: Just for future reference, - thaily - Jan. 27th, 2007 08:55 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: Just for future reference, - rs_studios - Jan. 27th, 2007 08:58 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: Just for future reference, - skanrashke - Jan. 27th, 2007 12:47 pm (UTC) - Expand
Re: Just for future reference, - rs_studios - Jan. 27th, 2007 12:52 pm (UTC) - Expand
Re: Just for future reference, - rs_studios - Jan. 27th, 2007 12:58 pm (UTC) - Expand
Re: Just for future reference, - skanrashke - Jan. 27th, 2007 10:50 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - sethcat666 - Feb. 9th, 2007 01:26 am (UTC) - Expand
neolucky
Jan. 26th, 2007 11:24 pm (UTC)
(Note: I'm not into the furry community at all, but I am basing my comments on experience with costuming in general)

What time frame is this? I don't see any dates and the fact Noblewolf said the suit was a year old, makes me wonder: Was the suit over a year old? Why did you wait so long, if you did?

If a hole "Developed" in the suit over time, then that's noones fault but your own, and this doesn't sound like it happened right away either, but gradually over time. Crafters and Suiters (I know NOTHING about this, honestly) should not be expected to fix every little stitch that pops, or issue after their "Warranty" is up.

He implied you had sex in your suit. So what? That really has no relevance to what this is about. That's a personal thing that you have to deal with.

Other fursuiters don't matter here, comparing one to the other makes this seem way bogus. It's not like they price match =p.

Even if it was "just 3 cons", that actually can damage a suit or costume really quickly. Heck ONE con can put wear and tear on a suit. And the dates of the times you wore them, leads me to believe you let far too much time pass before complaining about it.

This reeks of miscommunication.
johnnyblanco
Jan. 26th, 2007 11:54 pm (UTC)
Yes , not denying the suit was over a year old (barely, Got the suit 1/18/06 and noticed the hole 1/19/07).

Explaining.. again.. for the third time. The agreement was to have this suit and have it fit for FC. It didn't.. so I reserved the right to basically go elsewhere to get it TO fit.

The hole developed because I noticed my mates suit has a thicker fur with a thicker back and mine is thinner.. why is mine thinner? Maybe he figured that he was getting the short end of the stick of this deal and decided to go cheaper on the second suit. Dunno.

Other fursuiters will stand by their work. Hell I know of more than a few fursuiters that would fix that crap for free and a few local suiters that are going to help me with this issue.

What it is, is plain and simple.. I am tired of hearing the stories of people spending a grand and getting screwed over (points up to khmir). Trust me. There are alot of fursuiters out there that vie for business and you might want to steer clear of those that do cheap and shoddy work.

Johnny
skanrashke
Jan. 27th, 2007 12:50 pm (UTC)
Note: Most fursuiters have warrantees on their stuff- no one's stuff is warranted a year, I can tell you that off the bat. After a year, fixing it becomes your problem, because you're no longer protected by warrantee.
This isn't just for fursuits- its for cars, everything.

Secondly: If you needed a specific colour that only came in one shade and was hard to find, he probobly took what he could find. You probobly got a cotton backed(Thin, stretchy, not too much durability) fur, and your mate(If your mate has a different colour) got a polyester backed(Or double cotton knit). It happens, fur isn't a high demand product.

I'm not advocating either side in this, but the fact that your suit had violated the warantee due to its' age would have put this in a whole new light.
(no subject) - rs_studios - Jan. 28th, 2007 08:06 am (UTC) - Expand
tabbicus
Jan. 27th, 2007 12:50 am (UTC)
Noble asked me to post his side of the rebuttal...

http://noble-pro.livejournal.com/40507.html
thaily
Jan. 27th, 2007 01:36 am (UTC)
Just for future reference,
Holy crap.

This is entirely unrelated but he needs to learn how to hold down the shift key for each first letter of the sentence and afterwards use a spellchecker.
Isn't English the first language of most Ontarians? Yikes.

On a more related note, this specific situation aside, if he used less foul language it would do wonders for the impression he makes on other people which, at the moment, is not terribly professional.

Also, I'm not sure what "telling off an ass" entails for him but if that ass happens to be a customer it's better to stay polite and say "I've given you the service you paid for and I'm no longer interested in persueing this fruitless discussion. If you do not like my service feel free to patronize someone else next time."

The moral high ground may not sound like an attractive place, especially not when telling people off feels so good, but it could come back to bite you in the ass later. Now for example when potential customers see him responding to a disgruntled customer in an immature and irate manner.

I'm not privvy to the exact details of the transaction and the communication afterwards, but just the tone of Noble's response makes me want to side with Blanco.

In conclusion, Noble would have made a much better impression if his response was something along the lines of "I tried working with this customer but he was rude and made unreasonable demands. I'm sorry it didn't work out to our mutual satisfaction but I was forced to give up in the end after I had given him the full service owed to him for the amount he paid me."

Now, regardless of who's right, Noble has lost customers.
Re: Just for future reference, - johnnyblanco - Jan. 27th, 2007 02:01 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: Just for future reference, - tabbicus - Jan. 27th, 2007 02:45 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: Just for future reference, - johnnyblanco - Jan. 27th, 2007 04:45 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: Just for future reference, - thaily - Jan. 27th, 2007 08:42 am (UTC) - Expand
rs_studios
Jan. 27th, 2007 08:45 am (UTC)
For the record on what i fixed and saw at FC.

now i don't know a lot of the details on this. only that 2 suits were shipped. for a con. both did not fit.. were not even NEAR fitting. blanco asked if noble could fix the one that came a week earlier to fix using express shipping so it be ready. noble refused. he refused right after that con. which the suits were only a coupple months old. that no work would be done. thats all i know.

2 suits that don't fit properly.. should not need almost a YARD of material to fit. I had to use different colors that took me 6 hours to find to match and design to make blanco's suit almost 12 inches wider at chest and upper arms to fit. and make the head fit almost 3 inches around the forhead.. i can see an inch or at most 2 in error. it happens. but no..

i am not putting the work down. no. i am just stating what i had to fix.

blanco: the thinner backing on the fur meybe just the fur. unfortunately we can't all get fur from one company that makes all the desired colors. and have to shop around for the right ones. sometimes the right fur is a bit cheeper then one would want. but allowances for proper seams should make the suit just as durable.

wear and tear do happen in suits. even if all you do is take them off and put them on. heh.

i was happy to fix the suits and get the furs out there to play. and i would help anyone. and still will. i am not going to say what i think of nobles work. since he has bought several from me and destroyed them for the patterns and idea's. but thats his right they are his.

BlackFire

P.S. blanko: did the additions i made hold up ok?
chmarr
Jan. 28th, 2007 12:48 am (UTC)
Actually, clothing patterns (fursuits included) are copyrightable, and has been court-tested :) Whether or not you want to use that leverage is up to you :)
(no subject) - rs_studios - Jan. 28th, 2007 08:09 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - chmarr - Jan. 28th, 2007 08:51 pm (UTC) - Expand
( 45 comments — Leave a comment )

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