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So I wanted to snag a Halloween YCH that I saw in a post. I contacted the artist and send them the money. After sending the money, they sent me their TOS. So technically I agreed to a TOS I have never seen nor read.

The TOS was also not mentioned in the post. The TOS has a clause that says "after I have given you a sketch, refunds will not be issued" which makes me nervous. I feel like I should ask for a refund but I wanted a second opinion.

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( 9 comments — Leave a comment )
celestinaketzia
Sep. 24th, 2018 05:01 pm (UTC)
The onus is on the artist to ensure the client agrees prior to exchanging money. In addition, a ToS doesn't mean they can get away with murder. If they refuse you a refund you can file a chargeback.
gatekat
Sep. 24th, 2018 05:23 pm (UTC)
It means, to me, that no matter what you don't allow the commission to go past PayPal's 180 days to start a chargeback.

And I would avoid working with that artist again.

But asking for a refund now isn't a bad idea if it's a stress point for you.
mortymaxwell
Sep. 24th, 2018 05:55 pm (UTC)
I would cancel and ask for a refund. No refunds is a terrible policy and showing you the TOS after you've paid is unprofessional behavior. You've already gotten one unpleasant surprise. Do you want to put up with anymore rude surprises from them?
teekchan
Sep. 24th, 2018 06:49 pm (UTC)
It states no refund at all will be given? Because that's a no-no. I can understand partial given, as thats what my TOS says (partial refund if work has been started, full if not, full if I cancel)

I would either ask for a refund now, or if you really want the art, not allow it to go past paypals 180 days. (Honestly I follow the latter anyways unless the artist provides wips and shows good work ethic)

But, keep in mind, they may have assumed you read it before hand, and just automatically include it. I wouldnt assume off the bat that they had malicious intent with it.
alkraas
Sep. 24th, 2018 06:56 pm (UTC)
Well, after I paid they sent me their TOS per link. It wasn't included anywhere for me to read which struck me as odd. And it did indeed say that no refunds whatsoever will be issued after a sketch has been sent.

I asked for a refund just now because I just felt uncomfortable with their behavior. They asked me why I decided to cancel right after I recieved the refund and so I told them.
Their reponse was weird.
They said something along the lines of, and I'm paraphrasing here, "Yeah, my TOS is pretty new and I did not have one before so I forget to link it or even forget to give it to clients. For the refunds: I actually do partial refunds but I didn't state it yet because it never happened to me that someoen would want a refund".

So yeah, that response made me even more nervous and I'm glad I asked for- and got a refund
teekchan
Sep. 24th, 2018 09:12 pm (UTC)
Sounds more like theyre new and just dont know what to do, but I tend to never buy from anyone that says no refunds at all; its better safe than sorry
solomoriah
Sep. 25th, 2018 10:24 pm (UTC)
If you got a refund that easily they are just new to this and probably had no bad intent.
Eyenoom
Sep. 25th, 2018 02:19 pm (UTC)
"No refund after sketch" is a pretty common policy - I'd personally give them the benefit of the doubt; They might have forgotten to send it earlier, rather than it being a calculated action. Might be worth mentioning to them that you would have preferred being given their TOS before sending the payment, and they might consider linking to it on the sales post.

Ultimately, PayPal's TOS always trumph the artists'. The only way they can actually have their TOS matter in case a dispute is opened, is if they had written it directly into an invoice sent through PayPal

Edited at 2018-09-25 02:19 pm (UTC)
rendrassa
Sep. 26th, 2018 07:13 am (UTC)
This is literally what I do with my own invoices. ToS is attached right there, with the terms field containing "By paying this invoice, you agree to the attached terms."

Though I still don't have a no refunds clause.
( 9 comments — Leave a comment )

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