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Owed trade from Ninjakato RESOLVED

WHO: Ninjakato http://ninjakato.deviantart.com/
ScarlingRagdoll666 http://www.furaffinity.net/user/scarlingragdoll666/

WHERE: They're mostly active on dA than FA

WHAT: A long overdue trade with them that took place on FA. Communications eventually took place on dA through notes

WHEN: A trade was agreed upon April 9th 2011. My half was finished relatively quickly, but their half is still unfinished.

More info under cute



PROOF:
First initial trade contact was made on April 9th, 2011 https://www.dropbox.com/s/pluqssxagsbbnyu/proof%201.jpg?dl=0 (my FA here is Charu)

My half of the trade was completed May 4th, 2011 http://www.furaffinity.net/view/5691889

Communications on FA were made. Unfortunately my notes on FA have been cleared out since then. They mostly contained information about what I'd like Ninjakato to draw for their half.

Eventually I started to note her on dA as it appeared she was becoming less active on FA.
Note pointing out I finished my half https://www.dropbox.com/s/wb27h1reywz2gyl/Proof%202.jpg?dl=0

There was a point she posted a journal asking her watchers if she had missed anything owed. However, I cannot find the journal anymore, but I did note her on dA
https://www.dropbox.com/s/40volnp6m2yy3l0/proof%203.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/wu3kgjknydfs3cd/proof%204.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ya85gjdo9qaamg3/proof%205.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ckrzqijrjo2k7ky/proof%206.jpg?dl=0

After this communication had stopped until 2014 came around. I had stopped asking as Ninjakato seemed pretty busy in real life and I didn't want to be a bother.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/f6cslbr0dkabp4m/proof%207.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/a3ax54y49okn5zq/proof%208.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/h5ynncfmdjut8iw/proof%209.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/9onvgxjz5fqg6h6/proof%2010.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/at93e8bo9flkknj/proof%2011.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/k30co67uueaqqo9/proof%2012.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/roal3atboh43vj4/proof%2013.jpg?dl=0

August 20, 2014 she had made a journal calling out to the person she owed a trade to (which was me). My ref links did not work so I had noted with fixed links.
http://ninjakato.deviantart.com/journal/One-art-trade-477049101#comments
https://www.dropbox.com/s/5nrarciibugpru9/proof%2014.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/m8i4mljt8dawynv/proof%2016.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/mauwqzmx0qii5vo/proof%2017.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/woqc5v73w388obn/proof%2018.jpg?dl=0

More time passed and I saw no sign of my half of the trade. I gave her another nudge about it.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/b7uyt58myn7lyzi/proof%2019.jpg?dl=0

I gave one more nudge just recently. The note had been opened but went unresponded.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/1ge7uwcew3o6r5y/proof%2020.jpg?dl=0


EXPLAIN:
In the start of this NinjaKato was opening up for trades on FA. I was one of the ones picked to trade with her. Excited I began to work on my trade and posted to FA in a timely manner.
Eagerly, but patiently, I waited for for mine to be finished. I knew very well NinjaKato was really busy with her real life and commissions, so I was in no rush to have it completed. As time passed and weeks turned to months. Months turned into years. We've had some communication throughout the time span, yet I was still mindful not to rush her. She was still posting art on dA of finished commissions and personal art.

2011 had turned to 2014 and I admit I should of poked her more often between those few years. But I was nervous to do so as she was posting frequent journals about difficulties in her life. As a artist I know very well commissions always take priority over trades, thus I didn't pressure her.

Eventually I did poke her and communications had picked up once again. I had hope she'd finish it after I did remind her about it. A time of silence started again. NinjaKato was still posting personal art, newly finished YCHs and sometimes trades from others. I had given her one final poke on Nov 11th, 2015 and the note had been read. No response back. She continued to upload new art of personal sketches, redraws, YCHs, and adoptables.

At this point I am not expecting to see my half and have accepted it. Primarily posting this beware to give a heads up that this artist may not always finish pieces they promise to do.

EDIT: NinjaKato finished their half. This AB can be marked as resolved
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Do not go after persons posted about here, by leaving comments on their art pages.
If you have been posted about, please read I've Been Posted on Artists_Beware, Now What?

Comments

( 73 comments — Leave a comment )
Page 1 of 2
<<[1] [2] >>
celestinaketzia
Jan. 3rd, 2016 11:36 am (UTC)
Since 2011?!

My goodness, OP, you have the patience of a saint. Beware well warranted.
poizenkat
Jan. 4th, 2016 11:45 pm (UTC)
oh boy i really hope you get your owed art soon. thats way too long to keep someone waiting. Really sad, to be honest. I've been following their art for so long considering commissioning them but keeping someone waiting for 5 years is just not okay.
BestyBattalion
Jan. 5th, 2016 11:03 pm (UTC)
This was an art trade from years ago, There's a pretty big difference in priority. One is employed work the other is a casual activity done out of fun.
From what I can tell Kato turns out commissions in little under 2 weeks from their purchase so, this trade business doesn't reflect their business ethics in that area.
(no subject) - poizenkat - Jan. 5th, 2016 11:14 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - BestyBattalion - Jan. 5th, 2016 11:18 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - poizenkat - Jan. 5th, 2016 11:27 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - celestinaketzia - Jan. 5th, 2016 11:51 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - BestyBattalion - Jan. 5th, 2016 11:56 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - poizenkat - Jan. 5th, 2016 11:58 pm (UTC) - Expand
torkura
Jan. 5th, 2016 06:50 pm (UTC)
You should totally link this to their newest journal entry where they're talking about people being lazy and not finishing their stuff :P

Edited at 2016-01-05 06:57 pm (UTC)
celestinaketzia
Jan. 5th, 2016 07:37 pm (UTC)
Please no one actually do that.

If the OP wants to contact them privately about this post they are free to do so.
(no subject) - BestyBattalion - Jan. 5th, 2016 10:45 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - spartanwerewolf - Jan. 6th, 2016 07:02 am (UTC) - Expand
ninjakato
Jan. 5th, 2016 09:24 pm (UTC)
"Primarily posting this beware to give a heads up that this artist may not always finish pieces they promise to do." -- Excuse me?This has to do with ONE art trade.

I have been posting nonstop commissions and YCHs because that is how I live, it's what pays my rent and everything else. I work on art trades when I have spare time because that is when I can work on essentially free art.

I had full intention of doing my half but I believe I asked you a while ago (2015 I believe) if you still wanted the same character or a new one because I wasn't sure that character was dated or not, I don't think I got a reply. Therefore I didn't want to draw the character and find out you wanted another one.
The last time I got a note from you was https://i.gyazo.com/199db78a6df4a0d987fc5e9a6bbbe1e0.png Nov, 2015. Before that it was back in Feb 2015... That's a while between notes.
For a while there I thought you'd disappeared and therefore thought you were either gone or no longer interested.
I can't really excuse myself from a 5 years waiting period but again, your communication was random and sporadic and I have had people in the past just disappear out of nowhere about art trades. When that happens one can't help but assume they aren't interested in your work or that trade.

That being said I'm sorry I have been a bit busy working on commissions and paid work. I finished a few other art trades and (sorry) personal work. I have been exceptionally busy and if you notice, anything free I offer is taken in stride and others have patience because it's free.

-----------------

NB4 someone says -- "Well you should have thought about that before you ditched the trade!" -- I was under the impression that this place was a place for scammers and thieves... I had someone post an article on me back in the day about the same thing (an art trade) because I took too long in their opinion and they got told that this place was not for that.

So, here it is an article that is going to blast a negative review on my record for anyone who reads it because of a SINGLE art trade. It's going to make people feel like they can't trust me after I spent 2-3 years trying to build up a decent rep about being good on commission turn out times. I don't take trades spare for very rarely because I don't have time for them; because art is my work and how I live.
This is not only going to mar my business should anyone read it in its presentation, but it's also a slightly ridiculous reason to post someone up here.
This wasn't a scam, it was an art trade made 5 years ago which shoddy communication between both parties.
Several months in between communications is not a good ethic. If someone did that to me for a commission I'd be furious. In fact I have refunded people for that same reason.

Again, this was an art trade. If they wanted to keep it going they should note me, and NOT every few months =/ I have a LOT going on right now with work and commissioned pieces, so I apologize if it takes a while. They knew I was working on it but work comes first, sorry. People who paid me money come first =/ That's kind of priority.

That being said, I'll do the trade but man alive... I'm kind of surprised.


PS: https://i.gyazo.com/ed8a92a611d940c269ffe7434ecfd5c9.png From your recent note I can't help but feel like this seems more like a scare tactic. "If there is a chance you finish my half then I will edit the post saying the issue is resolved."
There's no legit reason to post this article as this is once incident. I could see several with a bunch of people who had the same experience but this is one instance, and honestly punishment doesn't fit the crime.





Edited at 2016-01-05 09:31 pm (UTC)
kayla_la
Jan. 5th, 2016 09:33 pm (UTC)
Excuse me?This has to do with ONE art trade.

If you're willing to do it to one person, why wouldn't you be willing to do it to others? You have to come at this from the angle of people other than yourself.

That said, to be honest, your aggressive 'it's just a stupid trade it's not even important and it's your own fault for not messaging me constantly!' response here would make me more wary of you than the post itself. You got paid in artwork, this wasn't a request, and shouldn't be treated as one. It is not 'free' when you have been given something.
(no subject) - poizenkat - Jan. 5th, 2016 11:20 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - kayla_la - Jan. 5th, 2016 11:25 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - poizenkat - Jan. 5th, 2016 11:30 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - Swift Yuki - Jan. 5th, 2016 11:48 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - kayla_la - Jan. 5th, 2016 11:53 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - Swift Yuki - Jan. 6th, 2016 12:10 am (UTC) - Expand
mod comment - celestinaketzia - Jan. 5th, 2016 09:39 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - anuvia - Jan. 6th, 2016 12:11 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - sapphistscot - Jan. 6th, 2016 12:21 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - stangwolf - Jan. 6th, 2016 03:18 am (UTC) - Expand
ninjakato
Jan. 5th, 2016 09:44 pm (UTC)
Reply to: kayla_la
'it's just a stupid trade it's not even important and it's your own fault for not messaging me constantly!' -- I never said ANY of that so kindly stop acting like I'm being an asshole here. It's not going to solidify your point.

My angle is this -- I do art for a living. When I have the time between working on things people pay for, I work on the free things I owe -- and yes, art trades are free work. It's an exchange of art but no payment is made and as I said I have had people ditch out on me for trades. However, I realize it is an art trade. It sucks but it happens.

I am looking at this article and I see it from another person's angle very clearly -- It makes me out to be a scammer over an art trade. Not a commission, not paid work, but an art trade. Not even several, just one. That is why I find this surprising.

Doing it once doesn't just automatically boost it up to everyone, that's a flawed logic because there's no proof to back up it's validity.
I'm a busy person because I have to be. It's how I live, eat, and pay rent. I had their trade marked on my front page to remind me to do it when I had the time to, so I could focus on it and give them something worthy of the wait. However, after several months of nothing from them I figured they weren't interested anymore.
Then came this.

It's like being able to hold this over someone's head to get them to do something.

celestinaketzia
Jan. 5th, 2016 09:50 pm (UTC)
Re: Reply to: kayla_la
A singular beware does not ruin one's reputation. We've had plenty of bewarees come into their posts, be polite and make amends and even gain business.

It's how you respond that changes the situation.
Re: Reply to: kayla_la - kayla_la - Jan. 5th, 2016 09:53 pm (UTC) - Expand
Re: Reply to: kayla_la - BestyBattalion - Jan. 5th, 2016 10:46 pm (UTC) - Expand
Mod Comment - celestinaketzia - Jan. 5th, 2016 11:34 pm (UTC) - Expand
Re: Reply to: kayla_la - stormrunner1981 - Jan. 5th, 2016 11:37 pm (UTC) - Expand
RE: Re: Reply to: kayla_la - Swift Yuki - Jan. 6th, 2016 12:18 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: Reply to: kayla_la - celestinaketzia - Jan. 6th, 2016 12:22 am (UTC) - Expand
RE: Re: Reply to: kayla_la - Swift Yuki - Jan. 6th, 2016 12:31 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: Reply to: kayla_la - celestinaketzia - Jan. 6th, 2016 12:34 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: Reply to: kayla_la - DeadGalaxyX - Jan. 6th, 2016 10:28 pm (UTC) - Expand
ninjakato
Jan. 5th, 2016 10:08 pm (UTC)
celestinaketzia
My main issue with this is that they say things like -- "Primarily posting this beware to give a heads up that this artist may not always finish pieces they promise to do." which yes, to someone who doesn't know me or my business ethic could read that and think twice, thinking I'm some kind of scammer.
I worked very hard to rekindle a rep of being consistent and timely with my commissions and to see this because of an art trade? It's really off putting.

I am as polite as I can be knowing the situation as it is and then reading how this is written. It demonizes me in this situation despite my having said they failed to keep communication. They were aware I am busy and that I had kept their trade in mind.
3-5 months in between communication doesn't really work for me when it comes to any kind of transaction unless it's preordained that that is to be the case. I'm used to responses from clients within a week or so on commissions at most.
After 3-5 months, or rather even a couple years in between replies, you generally assume someone isn't interested anymore.

Does this excuse my putting off their trade for commissions? Probably not, but as a working artist I have to have priorities and those are commissions. Maybe I should have just cranked out their trade and been done with it but again, after 3-5 months to 1-2 years of nothing in means of communications it's hard to feel like it's important to the other person.


It's hardly an overreaction for me to reply and defend myself with the other half of this situation and I'm surprised that it's been flagged as 'not important' because I question the validity of this claim. It's only fair that I do because again, this is one one instance, not several that would stand to claim I'm some kind of art trade scammer.
Again, after months of no communication from them I put their trade on the back burner due to having to do commissioned work as a means of business.
Paid commissions take priority. That's just how it is.

I intend on doing their trade regardless of how sticky this situation feels but man, it's soured my tastes a lot for these kinds of things.

Edited at 2016-01-05 10:13 pm (UTC)
celestinaketzia
Jan. 5th, 2016 10:19 pm (UTC)
Re: celestinaketzia
The length of time between replies does not absolve you of anything. You also could have contacted them at any time, especially knowing you owed them work. You dropped the ball.

Unfortunately, you're not going to be finding much sympathy from the crowd here. Majority of us are commission artists as well whom complete their obligations on time. They paid you with their own work, you owe them. That is just how it is.
RE: celestinaketzia - spartanwerewolf - Jan. 6th, 2016 07:21 am (UTC) - Expand
dragontripmon
Jan. 5th, 2016 11:12 pm (UTC)
Actually after reading the artist poor responses to these posts and BestyBattalion white knighting in regards to saying that commissions is a higher priority than trades.

I'm going to say your quite wrong here considering trades are the same thing as a commission. Especially since art was exchanged and the artist didn't do their part for years which shows quite a bad sign.
Which means if they can't finish trades in a timely manner that would say a lot about their business practices with commissions.
Swift Yuki
Jan. 5th, 2016 11:22 pm (UTC)
Okay but Kato DID say she tried to contact OP before and OP justs went "missing" over long periods of time so it's really more OP's fault for not keeping up as well. Kato didn't get responses in a timely manner and just worked with commissions and other pieces in the mean time.

Doesn't help OP's case because they're using this post as a scare tactic for force her to finish it NOW after she had to wait several months at a time for a response. :/
(no subject) - dragontripmon - Jan. 5th, 2016 11:29 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - Swift Yuki - Jan. 6th, 2016 12:23 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - dragontripmon - Jan. 6th, 2016 02:05 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - stormrunner1981 - Jan. 5th, 2016 11:31 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - Swift Yuki - Jan. 6th, 2016 12:25 am (UTC) - Expand
mod comment - celestinaketzia - Jan. 5th, 2016 11:40 pm (UTC) - Expand
Re: mod comment - dragontripmon - Jan. 5th, 2016 11:48 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - BestyBattalion - Jan. 5th, 2016 11:56 pm (UTC) - Expand
mod comment - celestinaketzia - Jan. 6th, 2016 12:03 am (UTC) - Expand
ninjakato
Jan. 5th, 2016 11:39 pm (UTC)
poizenkat
This is ONE art trade. One. Not a dozen, not even several. One.
Commissions are paid for, not trades.
The concept of "all time = money" only applies where money is being exchanged.
In this case it was art and as I said above, Nishastar left months in between communications and therefore logically I assumed they weren't interested and so I kept focus on things that people paid for.

5 years ago I accepted 3 art trades; one of which I haven't even seen the person's half of, but I digress...

I don't see anything as less or 'stupid' as you call it. However, where people's money is given to me to do work then yes, that is of higher importance, more so when they keep in communications with me over a span of time that isn't several months in between.
If it were a commission in this case I would have cancelled it and if it was prepaid, refunded them.
But it's not a commission, it's an art trade. One that given the time frame and lack of communications was lacking in urgency.
That's my point.

I'm not mad at Nishastar for their feelings by any means. However, this was not the way to get me to do something.
I don't accept art trades spare for one every few months if that, and that is with friends and people I know, who are aware of what's going on in my life. I also don't accept trades BECAUSE I know my time is restricted. I have a job as well as working as a freelance artist as well.

You can see it how you will but given that the situation seems very once sided, as it was said "you're not going to be finding much sympathy from the crowd here" so that proves to me that I, no matter what reason or explanation I say is just going to be ignored.

Please don't project this matter into every thing? One instance does not reflect on every single one of them. If you haven't done commission business with me then don't make accusations. That kind of thing can and will have a negative impact on someone's business outcome. People (like me) come here to check up on artists they wish to commission to see if they are trustworthy with commissions/money.
Seeing this and all the hubbub about how "NinjaKato can't be trusted to do anything on time" is bogus and unappreciated to say the least. This thread is about a single art trade (not even several), not a commission. Bear that in mind before you start tossing around accusations and speculations about my business ethics as a whole.


So that being said, Nisha, your trade will be done and from then on I wash my hands of this matter.

kayla_la
Jan. 5th, 2016 11:41 pm (UTC)
Re: poizenkat
Hello, please note that there is a 'Reply' button under individual comments that you should be using to respond to people directly. Otherwise, they may not see what you've said, and the lack of threading may confuse people.

EDIT: Sorry for Cel and I both informing you of this at the same time!

Edited at 2016-01-05 11:42 pm (UTC)
Mod comment - celestinaketzia - Jan. 5th, 2016 11:41 pm (UTC) - Expand
Re: poizenkat - poizenkat - Jan. 5th, 2016 11:48 pm (UTC) - Expand
Re: poizenkat - nishastar - Jan. 6th, 2016 03:29 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: poizenkat - ninjakato - Jan. 6th, 2016 04:19 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: poizenkat - nishastar - Jan. 6th, 2016 04:22 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: poizenkat - kayla_la - Jan. 6th, 2016 04:24 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: poizenkat - DeadGalaxyX - Jan. 6th, 2016 10:54 pm (UTC) - Expand
ninjakato
Jan. 6th, 2016 04:21 am (UTC)
http://ninjakato.deviantart.com/art/Nishastar-AT-582689845

The trade is done. I had the sketch done already from ages ago but it sat unused because again, I was not sure if it was to be continued or not.

I have completed it now.
ninjakato
Jan. 6th, 2016 10:46 am (UTC)
The trade is done so please, stop yelling at me about it as I get emails about it.
The trade has been done and this issue has been marked resolved.

Also, please stop saying I had an attitude. It was explaining my thoughts and view on the matter and why I personally had issue with the situation. That's not 'attitude'.

For the last time. The art trade has been completed.
The subject is done.
Thank you, and good day.
celestinaketzia
Jan. 6th, 2016 02:50 pm (UTC)
mod comment
You can turn off email notifications at any time via LJ's settings. Users are free to comment how they wish (within our guidelines) and we would appreciate users not attempting to moderate the comment section.

Edited at 2016-01-06 02:51 pm (UTC)
lackoflollies
Jan. 6th, 2016 10:45 pm (UTC)
Avoiding artist due to horrid attitude, and the disgustingly vague journal trying to gather sympathy.
aerospiritual
Jan. 6th, 2016 11:39 pm (UTC)
wow, man, yeah- art trades are an exchange of services and should be given the same kinda treatment as a commission.
BestyBattalion
Jan. 7th, 2016 01:37 am (UTC)
Can someone please mark this post's title as resolved as this is finished seeing as Nisha has received her artwork.
dragontripmon
Jan. 7th, 2016 01:59 am (UTC)
The moderator already marked this as resolved.
(no subject) - nishastar - Jan. 7th, 2016 02:00 am (UTC) - Expand
mod comment - celestinaketzia - Jan. 7th, 2016 02:01 am (UTC) - Expand
deepdarkvalley
Jan. 7th, 2016 03:57 am (UTC)
so very frustrating to see that the artist decided to act as they did, and went on to make a super vague journal about the situation... i don't understand why they think a beware alone is enough to completely ruin their reputation, but don't think that acting the way they did won't? i think if a good amount of the artists that get an AB posted would act more professional people would forgive them. people are generally pretty forgiving if you admit you made a mistake and were wrong :/

glad you got your art in the end, though, OP!
naritoshiniko
Jan. 7th, 2016 04:27 am (UTC)
Wow...what a poor attitude. :/ Won't be commissioning them anytime soon, no matter how pretty their art is. :/
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