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I commissioned two head shots stylized in the mannerism of a well known cd cover art.

No problem with communication nor payment, gave them the link to my Reference journal all went smoothly.

Headshots took maybe 2 weeks or so, though I was in no rush and no specific deadline was specified, so it didn't bother me.

The first head shot was delivered and was fine.

The second head shot took an additional few days, but when delivered the colors of my character were way off. I contacted the artist to ask which reference he used. upon response he said he used an image listed clearly under my "Favorite Commissions" not under "References". ( https://www.furaffinity.net/journal/5393419/ ) I contact them back and saying that that was not a good color ref and the better reference would be her actual reference sheet. I asked if they could recolor the image. To that I received no reply so I waited a day and a half before asking simply if they received my last message (note they were responsive before on average about once every 24 hours when contacted).

I then proceeded to see them make a post on their social media page complaining about "if you send an artist a reference... make sure its accurate"

At this point I am no longer interested in the icons. Emotionally I feel unconnected with them and do not wish to use nor see them as they are a reminder of this unpleasantness. I feel like a big jerk for wanting my money back, but honestly the unprofessional way in which the matter was handled and resulting emotional attachment problems I feel are more than adequate to request such.

NOTE: As a side note I just received a message from them stating, "Please send me a link to a color reference that is accurate and I will have it fixed."

... really REALLY dunno what to do here. Do I ask for my money back citing the unprofessionalism? do i regive the reference and then after make an A_B detailing the issue? Do I point out their error in the first place? (last option doesnt seem like any good would come of it since they blatantly used a non-ref image)

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( 42 comments — Leave a comment )
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celestinaketzia
Oct. 8th, 2015 10:23 am (UTC)
In this case I'd say an A_B or a refund is a bit premature. While the artist clearly did make a mistake, they are trying to rectify it. I think you're taking a vent rather personally, which is definitely understandable. They shouldn't have posted any venting about transactions in a public space, but we're human and have transactions that can be a little frustrating from time to time.

Let them attempt to fix it. Once it's fixed then the artist will have completed the art to specification. In this instance, sorry, your lack of emotional connection to the piece (aka buyer's remorse) doesn't warrant a refund.
anuvia
Oct. 8th, 2015 10:48 am (UTC)
I have a few questions!

When you linked the artist reference, did you give them individual links or did you refer them to that large journal? Also, has the total amount of time you have been waiting for an edit only a day or so? If so, that's a very short time to expect a drastic edit before wanting a refund.

As far as I can tell, I wouldn't consider a vague tweet about accurate references to be especially in poor taste, or enough to warrant calling them "unprofessional" or demanding a refund!
Gabrielle Wertzbaugher
Oct. 8th, 2015 03:29 pm (UTC)
I dont want a refund for the length of time, they were responsive quickly. the last message i wasnt sure if they actually received or not since they were active but not replying

I linked the journal, in the journal there are 4 images listed under references.

I also wouldnt call tweeting about a particular instance in public space professional, unless they're having this issue with several or more people, which indicates a bigger issue
(no subject) - gatekat - Oct. 8th, 2015 04:03 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - Gabrielle Wertzbaugher - Oct. 9th, 2015 01:40 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - vauvakolibri - Oct. 9th, 2015 02:16 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - anuvia - Oct. 9th, 2015 01:16 am (UTC) - Expand
killercacti
Oct. 8th, 2015 11:43 am (UTC)
If you linked him the above journal for reference, he might have inferred that any of the favorite commissions listed were possible color variations. If you are using this journal to show off references for commissions, maybe it's a good idea to make a note on the "favorite commissions" section saying not to use them as references, but that they show off the personality of your character, or something...just to prevent this from happening in the future.

I don't think you're entitled to a refund, unfortunately, since the work was done and he seems willing to recolor the icon for you. It sucks that he subtweeted (or appeared to subtweet) you...unfortunately this artist has been posted in AB pretty often (I know exactly who you are talking about, haha).
Gabrielle Wertzbaugher
Oct. 8th, 2015 03:31 pm (UTC)
I just googled and you are correct, next time i think ill be cross referencing a_b before purchasing

and yeh, i mean i thought labling things as references and putting them in a separate category would be good enough. =x
ctk_hullo
Oct. 8th, 2015 11:49 am (UTC)
I don't think a refund is called for, either, just let the artist fix the colours. In the future it will probably be better to link directly to references instead of a text-heavy journal. Something like, "Here's my character's reference: [ref link] and there's more information here if needed: [journal link]."
Gabrielle Wertzbaugher
Oct. 9th, 2015 01:37 pm (UTC)
Like I said below the issue was not with mix up, it was with the unprofessional posting of their grievances about the situation over a public media.
likeshine
Oct. 8th, 2015 01:58 pm (UTC)

Going forward, I would think about giving the artist a link or two that are correct, as opposed to linking them to a journal that had several images listed (if that is what happened, that is). Having a list of favorite commissions that are still "wrong" included along with your references is a little confusing. I say this as an artist who has done a lot a lot a lot of commissions.

And, I don't think you have the grounds to demand a refund. The work was completed, so even if you went the refund route you would only be entitled to a partial refund. The artist did the work. Please give them a chance to make your fixes.

Gabrielle Wertzbaugher
Oct. 9th, 2015 01:37 pm (UTC)
Like I said below the issue was not with mix up, it was with the unprofessional posting of their grievances about the situation over a public media.
gatekat
Oct. 8th, 2015 02:49 pm (UTC)
I have to say I agree with the artist's rant here. You gave a link, they used a ref given in that link, and you're now upset about which image of those you offered them that they chose.

Those 'favorite commissions' have no business in a set of links for references. Only references valid for use belong in a list of references.
Gabrielle Wertzbaugher
Oct. 8th, 2015 03:33 pm (UTC)
They didnt use a reference, which are clearly listed separately from the links listed as favorite commissions.

But the issue is not the muck up the issue is the professionalism or lack there of the artist showed by posting the situation publicly.
(no subject) - gatekat - Oct. 8th, 2015 03:52 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - Gabrielle Wertzbaugher - Oct. 9th, 2015 01:14 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - kattotang - Oct. 9th, 2015 05:47 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - tifaria - Oct. 10th, 2015 01:42 am (UTC) - Expand
aerospiritual
Oct. 8th, 2015 03:11 pm (UTC)
personally, as an artist, I would've immediately worked with the ref that is labelled as "very accurate" as opposed to the linked commissions- but at the end of the day, that's just me.

was it unprofessional of the artist to complain in public? absolutely- that's stuff for private conversation with friends, where the client and future clients aren't able to see it. venting is understandable, but doing so in public isn't excusable.

I don't think you're entitled to a full refund, maybe a partial- but if the artist is willing to work with you, why not let them fix the piece so that you can at least have some kind of positive outcome from this? it's not as though the artist has gone around and outed you in public and neither are they dragging your name through the mud as a bad client. it just sounds like a moment of frustration demonstrated in an unprofessional manner. personally, I'd take the fix and then just not work with that artist anymore.

I'm also kinda hesitant to say that this is partially on your end because at least, imho, it's clearly labelled what are references and what are commissions that depict the character in a manner that you enjoy- could it be clearer? I- I guess? in only as much as adding what is to be used as a character/color ref and what defines their personality. but as an artist, I wouldn't have any issue working from what you've given.
chaossal
Oct. 8th, 2015 04:21 pm (UTC)
I don't like their attitude about you ''sending them the wrong ref'' when in fact you did not. It's not that hard to read what your References are. Its there own fault that they chose art clearly listed as Favorite Commissions and not your references.

But since they have offered to fix it you are not entitled to a refund. I would just not commission that artist anymore. We have all had to do business with a artist we know now not to commission any more at some point.

Edited at 2015-10-08 04:23 pm (UTC)
roxyfur
Oct. 8th, 2015 04:49 pm (UTC)
Just like others above have said, I don't think you're entitled to a refund nor should you post an AB on the artist. Yeah, if the tweet was indeed about you, it was in poor taste. However they are going out of their way to recolor the image in question.

In the future I would consider linking one or two images as reference, and not a journal cluttered with a bunch of links. It can be very overwhelming and in some cases, frustrating. The more links you provide, the more mistakes you can expect from the artist, just because it can be difficult to work from several references rather than just one reference sheet. If you have a reference sheet that is perfectly clear, there is no need to link any other images. Coming from the perspective of someone who does 20+ pieces a week, it's much easier to copy and paste one image onto my canvas per character, and results in a more accurate piece in most cases.
magedragonfire
Oct. 8th, 2015 08:03 pm (UTC)
In the future I would consider linking one or two images as reference, and not a journal cluttered with a bunch of links. It can be very overwhelming and in some cases, frustrating. The more links you provide, the more mistakes you can expect from the artist, just because it can be difficult to work from several references rather than just one reference sheet. If you have a reference sheet that is perfectly clear, there is no need to link any other images.

Completely agree. If you don't have a full-body reference of your character that contains all of these details, perhaps it is time to invest in one? The fewer images an artist has to work from, the more likely you are to get something accurate to what you want.

Also, as far as correct colours go - even if you're not an artist (and trust me, I am not one!), it's pretty easy to put together a palette file for your character with swatches of the proper colours, like some artists do on reference sheets. Of course, depending on the lighting of the piece, an artist may not stay exactly on-ref for that, but that's to be expected*. It's definitely helpful to give a swatch along with your on-model anatomy/clothing references, especially if your references' colours are off.

(*#000000 stripes aside...)
(no subject) - Gabrielle Wertzbaugher - Oct. 9th, 2015 01:16 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - magedragonfire - Oct. 9th, 2015 05:07 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - roxyfur - Oct. 9th, 2015 07:15 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - wuvvumsoc - Nov. 1st, 2015 07:38 pm (UTC) - Expand
tylociraptor
Oct. 8th, 2015 05:14 pm (UTC)
The thing that stands out to me is... well, if it's so inaccurate, why is it listed under "favorite" commissions? I'd be likely to assume that any references/images listed could be used for reference. There's no note saying, for instance 'This shows off their expressiveness well, but the colors are off'.

As said above, it is overwhelming and frustrating to have a number of references, much less ones that are conflicting and contradictory to each of them. I don't think it was unprofessional at all of the artist to post a little vent statement. They did not name you, they did not call you out, and for all you know, it could be about someone else, or multiple persons! To me, I'd have seen it as a statement that I can totally agree with and relate to, and not something where I would have ran and said "oh, are you talking about ______?" Or "who are you talking about?" It's something any artist might say, regardless of current clients or issues.

I don't feel an AB is appropriate in this situation. Additionally, the artist did the work based off of the references YOU as a client supplied. They are even willing to make corrections despite the fact that frankly, I don't think they are obligated... again, you supplied them with a number of links for reference and made no mention that any of them were inaccurate. You are in no way entitled to a refund.
ankewehner
Oct. 8th, 2015 05:39 pm (UTC)
Yeah, that first line is my thinking, too.

The entire journal is titled "Reference Page", there is nothing on the "favourite commissions" lists indicating that you consider them inaccurate; that those images are labelled "favourite" sounds to me like you're happy with them, in other words, they are examples of what you hope to get from future commissions.

I mostly do trades rather than commissions, but during that I've worked with people who provided commissions as their preferred references.

So it doesn't seem all that unreasonable for an artist to use a commission from that page as basis for their work.
(no subject) - Gabrielle Wertzbaugher - Oct. 9th, 2015 01:32 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - spytdragonfyre - Oct. 9th, 2015 03:24 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - Gabrielle Wertzbaugher - Oct. 9th, 2015 01:34 pm (UTC) - Expand
doladdar
Oct. 8th, 2015 08:23 pm (UTC)
the social media comment/venting was a bit unprofessional i agree

but you have to keep in mind that artists deal with commission inquiries constantly. it's hard to keep your thoughts totally organized when you're reviewing 10 15 20 or even more inquiries loaded with character information in one sitting. it's best not to make your reference list a mine field of incorrect images. this would have been something that I myself would have easily accidentally overlooked and mistook one of the favorite commissions as a reference.
Truant Verreaux
Oct. 8th, 2015 08:47 pm (UTC)
I don't think asking for a refund if they've already finished the work is a good thing to do, since they have already completed the work you'd basically be forcing them to have done all that for free.

I'd just resend the ref though because it's possible they just missed it. I think an AB or a refund seems a little bit of an extreme reaction even if your feelings were a little hurt. they shouldn't have said that but at the same time the proposed punishment does not fit the crime.
tinypup
Oct. 8th, 2015 08:51 pm (UTC)
Mostly agreeing with what's already posted and saying next time, link to specific references, not a journal with what seems to be a bunch of them. I'd personally suggest the CoconutMilkyway one because it's an actual flat-colour ref sheet that shows all the markings from different views and would be the most helpful to an artist.
As it stands, even the refs that you have in the "reference" section have slightly different colours on each of them, and some are even soft-shaded. Things like that can be hard to work with. Just FYI.
kontonakuma
Oct. 8th, 2015 08:54 pm (UTC)
Commenting as an artist, it is extremely confusing to be linked multiple references, especially if you have commission work of other artists and no information on why said piece is used as an image of reference. I don't think it's fair to the artist to put all the blame on them for getting the colors incorrect.

Now, commenting as a commissioner, I most certainly wouldn't think I was entitled to a refund. I'd just make a note not to commission said artist again and take this as a lesson to be more clear or to get a clearer ref sheet before commissioning another artist.

As for the tweet, unless they are clearly retweeting you or mentioning your name, I'll echo others in that you may be taking it too personal. Not having a clear ref is a frequent problem for many artists and it is frustrating after a while.
pinkpuppybelly
Oct. 8th, 2015 10:39 pm (UTC)
Sorry, but you're not entitled to a refund.

1) The artist did the work, and it looks like they plan to fix the color issues.

2) If your entire journal is labeled 'reference', don't assume any artist is going to think 'hmm, now which of these are ACTUAL references'. It's up to you to supply ONLY ACCURATE images for reference.

3) They vented on their own social media (twitter, I assume?), and it doesn't sound like they called you out by name. It is their prerogative to be able to vent in a space that should be 'safe' for them to do so.

I know that sucks to hear, and you probably will always be soured on those icons. But unfortunately, them's the breaks.
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